DESERT

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anon (not verified)
DESERT

The world will not be saved. Global anarchist revolution is not going to happen. Global climate change is now unstoppable. We are not going to see the worldwide end to civilisation/capitalism/patriarchy/authority. The world will not be saved. This realisation hurts people. They don't want it to be true. But it probably is.

Yet to be disillusioned - with global revolution/with our capacity to stop climate change - should not alter our anarchist nature, or the love of nature we feel as anarchists. There are many possibilities for liberty and wildness still.

What are some of these possibilities and how can we live them? What could it mean to be an anarchist when global revolution and world-wide social/eco sustainability are not the aim? What objectives, what plans, what lives, what adventures are there when the illusions are set aside and we walk into the world not disabled by disillusionment but unburdened by it?

Discuss...

anon (not verified)
'The world will not be saved'

2020 is a good year for people who believe in salvation via collapse

anon (not verified)
what about "will not be saved"

are you not getting? "salvation" is being saved, right? or are you making a point i'm not getting?

anon (not verified)
salvation

there are still plenty of people who believe in salvation/being saved and plenty of those believe it will come via collapse, mr. angery. this year has strengthened many of those people's beliefs. believe it or not, not everyone has read desert, and not everyone who has read it 'believes' it.

it's funny that some people respond to criticism of desert in the same way that communists respond to criticism of marx, or christians respond to criticism of the bible.

anon (not verified)
your brief initial sttement was unclear

whether you were talking about desert's message, deser'ts readers, or the population at large. you've made it more clear now, so... cool.

anon (not verified)
Desert author

What I want to know is who wrote it and more importantly have they wrote anything else?

anon (not verified)
Okay FBI

Why is this important for you? Building another personality cult? You need a new guru?

The author(s) is/are just a good writer(s) with enough well-sourced references in their heads.

Also Death of the Author maybe? I'm not sure that Desert would have spread the same way or being so long-lasting if people would know who did it. This is the same with the biggest reason why I post anonynomous comments, even if that some people seem to respect my pseudonymous comments.

Beyond the issues of stardom and security culture, sometimes YOU JUST WANT AN IDEA TO PASS ALONG, and don't want your identity to be a bias in other people's minds.

anon (not verified)
My understanding is that the

My understanding is that the author was associated with the British eco-anarchist journal Do or Die. Take with a grain of salt; I might be wrong.

anon (not verified)
so basically, they are a

so basically, they are a boomer from the uk...

desert, by some boomer from the uk just doesn't have that shiny appeal call hello anymore.

anon (not verified)
OK zoomer

> boomer

*gen x

anon (not verified)
FTFY

"what adventures are there when the illusions are set aside and we walk into the world not disabled by the illusions of the usual libcoms but unburdened by these?"

The workerist A-Fed types have been first and foremost the biggest builders of the global revolution Grand Illusion, along with the Maoists of course. And their generic texts are still posted on this site on a regular basis... :-( Of course not everyone in Thecollective likes this, as Chisel & Greg make it pretty clear, so why why why keeping this dead horse "alive", in 2020? The pro-social isolation Red anarchists are now behaving openly as agents of the totalitarian State, telling us to "stay the fuck home" and do their Rev on Facebook/Twitter/Zoom... this is bluntly what they are saying.

TheTao (not verified)
anarchistlibrary also has tons of boring

leftist texts, and like you i don't want to hear anything more from workerists and marxists. Thecollective won't even purge JZ's content, and the last time i recommended that it got erased. JZ already has a huge fanbase, why not replace his old man yarns with stuff that's funnier and/or more practical?

anon (not verified)
thetoe, why don't you find this funnier/more practical stuff

and submit it?

TheTao (not verified)
oh i do

with my zany, hostile, stupid, nihilistic comments, but then then it will get deleted often. There was even a very controversial and disturbing TOTW i submitted once for the sake of challenging one of the major tensions in anarchist thought (to put in a few words, exclusion politics), and the collective just took the little part of it they liked, removed all the emotionally disturbing stuff, didn't tell me why they weren't publishing the article as i politely asked them to do when i emailed it to them. This is what they replaced my TOTW with:

https://anarchistnews.org/content/totw-anarchists-take-stage

now, that is actually a good topic of the week, and i don't mind it that they used the "story" theme of the one i submitted, however i did ask them to tell me that IF THEY DIDN'T THINK IT WAS WORTHY OF POSTING, to tell me why.

The other issue is that i don't appreciate submitting content or writing through an attempt of trying to push the things i want into an anarchist box. What's the point even? I'll try to play games while in anarchist territory a little bit but in the end the more filters i apply to my self-expression the more awkward and idiotic it feels.

Peter (not verified)
The trouble is there are many

The trouble is there are many anarchist sectarians and they cannot see it themselves, like that forest saying, CANT SEE THE FOREST COS THE NEARBY TREES ARE IN THE WAY.The analogy being, their ideology/belief morality is in the way, and the ressentiment that grows out of the binary rivalry and mean hearted inequality, which breeds slot-nutted sourballed fecefied ideas like revolution to be squirted out! Enough I say, the next visionary paradigm must include the premise that there are now 7 billion lost polyfools on this planet who have 7 billion eager anarch overborn wisdom eaters trying to fight and tear themselves out of their dead bodies, AND WE HAVE TO BE GENTLE AND RESPECT the gradual incremental awakening of this writhing mass of future creative megasmart polywits to emerge ;)

anon (not verified)
AF ETC

Agree 100%, except with the suggestion that red anarchists should be somehow banned from the site. anews is non-sectarian. If you want AF off the front page, you need to submit better content to bump them down.

TheTao (not verified)
I overall agree that sectarian BS is also boring

and i guess the charm of the site is that overall they just post submitted content...

and overall i guess the left is just better for gaining popularity because it's more inclusive in terms of types of rebels. Overall it's also sad to me that people can't find better and more anarchic ways to synthesize different points of view...there's really good reason why stirner's texts have gained so much popularity even if stirnerism's popularity is practically nil. I'm the only person i know who has dedicated a lot of time to reading his texts...

anon (not verified)
That's the problem I think...

It is a non-sectarian site, tho not anti-sectarian. So basically sectarian groups can post their dogmatic drivel here in order to promote their views/agendas. Which sux.

Tho not sure there's a better alternative, as if some R&B gang gets banned, this might as well set the precedent for less dogmatic authors to also be blocked on less clear premises.

Maybe just posting more content that steers away the eventual followers of these cults might help. What Chisel & Greg have been doing is fun too, tho maybe the joke will wane over time, maybe not? I hope it never wanes. https://anarchistnews.org/content/popular-classes-world-pandemic-crisis-...

Peter (not verified)
I find it terrifying that

I find it terrifying that serious nihilists are not taken seriously on this site. Very ominously apolitical, unless its fear also?

anon (not verified)
seriously

it''s an anonymous internet forum. nothing is taken seriously here.

anon (not verified)
"nothing is taken seriously here"

Yes, because you said so, I am not taking YOU seriously.

Peter (not verified)
Have you ever heard of satire

Have you ever heard of satire, its having fun and still being serious, the best of both attitudes.

anon (not verified)
ANTI-poliotical, not A

ANTI-poliotical, not A-political

Peter (not verified)
Agreed, but viruscentric or

Agreed, but viruscentric or virocentric would be an even more nuanced choice of wording to describe the broader aspects of social dissociation ;)

SirEinzige
Niche anarchists and desert

Why do ya'll keep making such a big deal about this overrated document. Most of it's predictions(which are based on worse case scenarios) probably will not happen. The world might well be maintained and if it isn't it will be resource depletion(Grain in Rome Oil in Modernity) or other factors(cosmic) that do it all in. There's really nothing profound or useful about Desert.

TheTao (not verified)
I personally don't

Yet, some of its predictions are already happening, the global south is getting really hot and people are moving north...

The real question is why do any of us really care so much about non-fiction facts? Being human means that the truth in the stories we tell is not of any greater significance than the lies...

SirEinzige
Some marginal aspects of the preductions are happening

But I see nothing earth shaking that's happening and to the degree that it is there are other factors such as resource depletion which I see as the bigger factor is KOing this civilized world order.

anon (not verified)
'But I see nothing earth

'But I see nothing earth shaking that's happening'

You'd be singing a different tune if your home had been burnt to the ground after a year long drought, whitey.

SirEinzige
I ain't white dude

black/white mulatto brown to be exact. And that's been happening in the global south for a long time now. On the whole there's actually been improvements not contractions. Look at Africa as an example where various countries have moved up the freedom and safety index(the opposite of what David Kaplan predicted). The signs of 21st century desertification are simply not happening. Now species extinction and resources depletion, that's another issue.

TheTao (not verified)
but the dissapearance of wildlife

overall is a form of "desertification", i didn't enjoy reading desert due to exact predictive ability but because it helps me think about some of the implications of global warming. Not sure what safety and freedom index has to do anything, those indicators and many statistics to me feel like a load of bull.

In reference to the whole third/first world thing, i've read about a lot of farmers who've been having trouble growing crops and some link it to global warming . I've read about this occurring both in africa and in the mid-western united states...

SirEinzige
Sure you could say that

Structural species extinction due to extraction and transaction for me should be the prime issue along habitat loss. However desertification was defined by this dude in terms of climate which, again, was based on worse case scenarios which may or may not all happen. Certainly some of the things are undeniably happening.

I've actually been very happy with the release of Planet Of The Humans recently as it brings back old school conservation ideas and puts then at the forefront over the climate change issue. As predicted by John Michael Greer among others you are now seeing certain pro-green detractors of that film throw out the term ecofascist see here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTYJCAxlOgs just before the 4 minute mark.

The green types who trump up worse case scenarios of climate change usually all are part of some technocratic machineological solution to this and want to maintain the complicated processeses of extraction and transaction without asking deeper questions.

Fauvenoir (not verified)
Not to double down on SE, but

Not to double down on SE, but just to point out the basic physics that some climate doomsday prophets are overlooking... Desertification just won't happen in humid climate regions, which still comprise a lot of the global south.

It ain't that easy as it looks to find the causes of what can turn humid into dry/acidic areas. Sometimes it's specific types of air and/or water pollution, in other places it's over-use of water resources...

"Climate Change" is one big concept, containing a lot of inherent epistemological problems, that's far too vague to elicit any clear, solid conviction in me. All I'm really convinced is that over-use of natural resources as well as pollution are having a very detrimental effect on ecosystems, locally and perhaps globally as well. Tho not sure I'd call that climate change.

TheTao (not verified)
to tell you the truth i don't think

anything should be or is the prime issue, and altogether i don't think anything that anyone writes or says needs to be believed...

anon (not verified)
'The green types who trump up

'The green types who trump up worse case scenarios of climate change usually all are part of some technocratic machineological solution to this and want to maintain the complicated processeses of extraction and transaction without asking deeper questions.'

Well, I'm sure that's the first time the author of Desert has ever been accused of that...

anon (not verified)
The ocean is a DESERT with

The ocean is a DESERT with itß life swimming around.

anon (not verified)
A whole lotta people just

A whole lotta people just did a huge dump into the aquarium dude !

anon (not verified)
ocean

over the last 50 years there has been a 50% reduction of life in the ocean.

TheTao (not verified)
@7:59

oh i see you're making a really dumb sounding comment to sound like me and hopefully teach me a lesson. Cute!

anon (not verified)
No my dad played this song

No my dad played this song the other day which had those words in it. Also something about forgetting the name of a seahorse they had been feeding all day, in an aquarium. It was wierd music they sounded like stoners, thats why it sounded dumb I spose,,,,

TheTao (not verified)
what song???

I NEED BEAUTIFUL LYRICS TO GET ME THROUGH THIS SHORT AND MISERABLE LIFE.

anon (not verified)
On the first part of the

On the first part of the journey
I was looking at all the life
There were plants and birds and rocks and things
There was sand and hills and rings
The first thing I met was a fly with a buzz
And the sky with no clouds
The heat was hot and the ground was dry
But the air was full of sound

I've been through the desert on a horse with no name
It felt good to be out of the rain
In the desert you can remember your name
'Cause there ain't no one for to give you no pain
La, la, la la la la, la la la, la la...
La, la, la la la la, la la la, la la...

After two days in the desert sun
My skin began to turn red
After three days in the desert fun
I was looking at a river bed
And the story it told of a river that flowed
Made me sad to think it was dead

You see I've been through the desert on a horse with no name
It felt good to be out of the rain
In the desert you can remember your name
'Cause there ain't no one for to give you no pain
La, la, la la la la, la la la, la la...

After nine days I let the horse run free
'Cause the desert had turned to sea
There were plants and birds and rocks and things
There was sand and hills and rings
The ocean is a desert with its life underground
And a perfect disguise all above
Under the cities lies a heart made of ground
But the humans will give no love

You see I've been through the desert on a horse with no name
It felt good to be out of the rain
In the desert you can remember your name
'Cause there ain't no one for to give you no pain
La, la, la la la la, la la la, la la...

TheTao (not verified)
yeah that's one of my favorite ones...

and the ocean is a desert with its life underground...

anon (not verified)
Maybe you should head out

Maybe you should head out into the desert where one finds the self,,,,,,,
Stirner found an immense desert,,,,,,,,,

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