Portland, OR: Anarchists Are Fixing Potholes On City Streets

  • Posted on: 14 March 2017
  • By: thecollective

From the Portland Anarchist Road Care Facebook via It's Going Down

Anarchists in Portland, Oregon have taken to the streets – to fix the roads! Proclaiming that “We Will Fix the Roads,” anarchists are fixing potholes on city streets and reporting on it on social media.

On February 28th the group wrote:

Successful preliminary action today. We patched 5 potholes on SE Salmon, between 37th and 39th. We will observe them over the following days and weeks to see how lasting our patches are.

Thanks everyone for their support!

On the group’s Facebook page, it described why it was taking these actions:

Because we believe in building community solutions to the issues we face, outside of the state.

Because society portrays anarchists as only breaking windows and blocking roads.

Because when faced with anarchism as a political theory, statists often ask, “But who will fix the roads?”

Because the city of Portland refuses to adequately repair roads in a timely manner.

We are Portland Anarchist Road Care. We believe in community oriented direct action. We believe the state cares more about funding a militarized police force…than caring for and repairing the roads.

The city of Portland has shown gross negligence in its inadequate preventative care through this winter’s storms, and through its slow repair of potholes as weather has improved. Daily, this negligence is an active danger to cyclists and causes damage to people’s automobiles, and an increased risk of collision and bodily injury.

Portland Anarchist Road Care aims to mobilize crews throughout our city, in our neighborhoods, to patch our streets, build community, and continue to find solutions to community problems outside of the state.



April Fools Day came a little early this year.

Fucking goomba liberals doing the state's job for them.

If you care to elaborate, I'd love to see your apparent position against filling potholes laid out (assuming your position is from an anti-authoritarian standpoint). How does filling potholes indicate liberalism? From my point of view, I don't want the state to have a job, so I see both practical and propaganda value in this.

I don't want civilization to have a job.

Aww that's cute, lil primmie guy here thinks holes in the street hurt civilization. you're so rewilded.

But platformists fighting on the forefromt of civilization will bring forth the rev? Am I hallucinating, or is this the reification of that old New Deal farce of people working to fill holes other have dug?

If by "holes other have dug" you mean the natural wear-and-tear on roads caused via their intended use, then sure, it's absolutely literally exactly the same thing.

-a guy who knows absolutely nothing about how or why roads are built but still sees their destruction as a solution to all the world's problems

Someone doesn't think potholes are attacks on civilization so they must be "platformists," of which there are 14 in the entire world and they don't post on anews. Look how sad and defensive you are. And yes, you are hallucinating, apparently.

I actually think that anarchists should stop training in basic medical care because medicine is a tool of science which is just totally the same thing as capital. And therefore we're doing the state's job when we treat people who get pepper sprayed or whatever. Plus it's good obamacare is getting repealed because there's too many people on earth anyway and they're all defenders of civilization and society too.

and fuck obamacare! (whatever happened to single-payer, universal coverage?)
objectify much? what is The State to you, anyway?

The state to me is literally everything that has to do with the state or with capital. Like your boring "I took logic 101 at university" pro-civilization arguments. and yeah fuck obamacare but fuck universal coverage. What kind of totalitarian nightmare platformist believes in "universal" anything? Plus statism, get real leftist cuck. We on some rewilding shit now, potholes and blowholes (whales, very rewilded creatures)

Uh well let's see. false analogy, red herring. Argument from authority (down to the "meaning" of "words") and also strawman. Begging the question, begging the answer, beating the dog off. Strawman, gender essentializing and uh... confusing causation for correlation. Cool, think I'm done here. Oh yeah, critical self theory. Peace out!

Any health care you need can be found growing in your back yard and anyone who disagrees with that statement is a fascist platformist commie liberal.

considering that your backyard is immediately connected to the neighboring forest where witches and faeries live

prayer and magik are the only valid health care and if you disagree with me you are a platformist

The State? A sick band from Ann Arbor--NO ILLUSIONS!

We need these guys in Oakland, CA bad. The pavements more fucked up than any ive ever seen. 880 when getting into oakland is terrible; the asphalt is so broken that it has turned to thousands of pebbles and when driver drive over them they kick up and hit your windshield hard enough to leave dents every morning on the way to work and when are they ever going to finish building that fuckin bridge that's been under construction for 7 years? anarchists can get that done faster without payment. Where is all the fucking money going to maintain shit that every other city has no problem maintaining? ? wow.

Yeah but breaking up the concrete is a universally applicable tactic that's appropriate in any context, so if anything anarchists should probably help finish ripping up the roads. Don't defend SOCIETY bro

We have noted your complain filed at 06:57, on Tuesday, 03/14/2017, and included this quote outstanding in the ticket:

"the asphalt is so broken that it has turned to thousands of pebbles and when driver drive over them they kick up and hit your windshield hard enough to leave dents every morning on the way to work and when are they ever going to finish building that fuckin bridge that's been under construction for 7 years"

Your input appreciated! The best thing that WE, anarchists, can do is to aimlessly and endlessly repair the roads of civilization, for free, so that the machines of the citizenry can still ride without physical damage, and in this way American can be Great Again.

Let's unite to maintain civilization and defend property against damage. Those cars are LIVES to us, and fuck those primmie animals, kids and cyclists dying on the roads for their unruly, right-wing presence on the streets of our Great Society, built by WORKERS.

Anarchy is order.

Love Big Brother.

lol if you're not pro-pothole you had children and life and cyclists (???) and must think that the only thing anarchists should do is fill potholes

Fuck that dog, I just walked down the street and empty everyone's mailboxes into the gutter. Did you know that the state delivers mail and that keeping the gutters clear just helps civilization keep from getting flooded? There's opportunities to attack everywhere. I saw someone sweeping and I was like, "You're keeping the great wild from burying the ruins of civilization you LITERAL FUCKING PIG-COP!" Like 14 people on tumblr agreed with me too!

false analogy

to say that something is a false analogy one has to specify which analogy (and analogy in what sense) is false, and then, more, how. The rhetoric of "false analogy" sounds nice but it doesn't amount to much given a simple statement. If A and B are unlike C and D, the relation between (A and B) and (C and D) (unlike) is rarely unfounded; it may be rhetorically weak; and it isn't supposed to be exact. I'm asking this question as a follow up because I don't see what you mean; and I would like to because I would like to understand the mechanics of this informal fallacy (as you perceive it in this instance).


Lol truth in analogy is a spook you liberal platformist

We use truths all the time; for instance you used several in constructing the sentences you used; to get from point A to B; to get up from your computer to recall how to drink water. The question is what do we mean by truth. If we aspire to something anti-realist, your claim is ridiculous; if we aspire to some correspondence theory, the possibility of arriving at truth is either trivial or non-trivial. To see an analogy doesn't require a spook per se, but rather, the possibility of seeing the third as either platonic or aristotelian. I suspect that platonism is ridiculous, but pragmatic aristoteleanism is hardly useless. Also, Im hardly a platformist. But I get that you probably don't wish to engage? If not, why not?

Because engaging with you is supporting society and spookifying my uniqueness. Read Stirner.

Hey man I take offense to this. First of all, letters are literally alive and I love them. And also, as an anarchist I'm a platformist and I literally support the state and capitalism and think we should defend their interest. I mean, since I don't think all destructive tactics are universally applicable in all contexts, I must just be a defender of the status quo in all situations. Yep. If only I could see that literally everything is poisoned by my enemies and come to properly hate myself and beat off to anime gifs on tumblr all day and start a sick podcast w my tumblr friends

so , fix potholes then on your street or whatever. just, why claim it as an Anarchist deed, to go around the city-at-large, fixing civil-infrastructure .? why?

For that matter why should anarchists organize direct action against local bosses when workers are just gonna use their wages to buy commodities that support the global capitalist infrastructure and also civilization? Ugh! Platformists!

Your argument is invalid because nihilism

Whatever, I'm the nihilist, you're the platformist

You say I'm not a real nihilist? LOL. I've been to every bookfair on the west coast since 2014. I've read and memorized every ITS communique from all the way back when they still called themselves Wild Reaction (RS). I have a Stirner sticker covering the apple logo on my Mac Book Pro. You don't know who your messing with cuck

oh, right then, sorry. I thought you were a platformist. we friends on tumblr? I mostly repost memes about how I don't even stand up most days

True. But since there's tons of different people out there doing many useless things they deem as "purposeful" and even "good" in their minds, it's kinda understandable we end up with this kind of liberal stupidity being done to appeal to the public, and provide an answer to a conventional irrational argument against anarchism.. especially in a place like Portland where seemingly anarchists haven't got anything better to do than take part in some imagined "public debate".

So I guess... let them do it and let's see how it floats. Not going to change anything in my life anyways.

I'm taking note that you were soft on platformism

Funny shit tho if I get to see some citizen scraping off any vegetation growing through the pavement, you're talking about some real, micro-scale pro-civ fascism right there. Un-sarcastically.

And there are people doing that too, for real. So I'm wondering to what extent they'd be working in unison with those pothole fillers.

Only potholes worthy filling are those for plants. Fuck your cars, and their civilization...

You know what else is fascist? Gardening! Fuck that pro-domestification bullshit. Literally "weeding" the desirable from the undesirable...you're basically a fucking cop!

(Which is a funny sentence, by the way.)

So, umm, I ain't opposed. Potholes suck for cycling, and that's what I do. Would be cooler to have some of spray paint tag to indicate who did it, rather than Facebook etc. as the means of talking about it.

Anyway, yes, destroy the streets also. Not actually any contradiction between pro- and anti-pothole filling.

It's the massive streams of motor vehicles that have been causing potholes, as well as poor road designs that only serve the agenda to provide a constant influx of money to road maintenance companies (as a slightly more complex version of the "dig up/fill in" labor pattern).

To fill them up won't change a shit on the long run. More cars and especially trucks is just going to cause cracks and hole in those mediocre roads.

But I'll be into giving some energies helping maintain bike roads, tho. Or anything that's on one or two wheels. A system based on 4+ wheels motor vehicles is the true horror.

pothole filling... is not enough?!

Anyway: there are literally potholes all over the neighbourhood near my house. If they were fixed, there would be new potholes, yes, but I would personally reap some benefits in the short term.

A not incomparable problem is groceries. If you fix the problem of groceries in some sense - by, oh, looting the grocery store - the fix is only temporary. But, um, the direct action in this case would not be critiqued as hard. No one could be called a liberal for having done it.

Obviously filling potholes is probably more appealing to populists than stealing grocries, since Public Opinion is against Crimes That Look Like Crimes (incidentally, filling a pothole without proper authorization is certainly a crime in most North American jurisdictions), but whooooooo giiiiiiiiiives a FUCK.

It's got value as propaganda, but I really hope that anarchists aren't seriously using their limited time and resources to act as free labor for the State on the reg. I can think of about a million other more worthwhile projects. But hey, whatever floats your boat I guess, it's not worth hating on.

fill the potholes with the rubble of destroyed prisons. Or demand the budgets of police departments and prisons go to fixing streets instead, at least.

FYI: The people who are happy that anarcho-liberals are fixing the roads are not the same people who will be happy when the prisons and police stations get burned down.

Don't delude yourselves.....The liberals will stab you in the back as they enjoy their nice smooth commute to the office.

Yeah my man only liberals use roads, you get it.

Oh, you don't want people to stab you in the back? Sounds like someone believes in SOCIETY and MORAL NORMS. Platformist, pathetic

If one were to take the chant "Whose streets? Our streets!" seriously, then presumably we would want to keep our streets in good condition, right?

good condition for what?

Driving, riding and walking on without risk of inflicting damage or injury.

Driving - supports the state and the industrial car industry and the flow of commodities
Riding - ditto
Walking - the same, also ableist, and exercise is a sickness of neoliberal body responsibility and emotional labor
aversion to risk - NOT INSURRECTIONARY
damage or injury - obvious defender of the megamachine of industrial health

You must be some kind of leninist-platformist-fascist

These are not your streets, dumbo. These are the streets of the State and its capital. Of its machinery. The streets are not made for people, but for those death machines to ride.

They can be made into serving people, but you gotta stop the cars and trucks from using these. This is where fixing the road becomes a reactionary practice... as it's helping those machines to keep riding no matter the pollution, harm and deaths they'll cause.

Yep. Just the other day I saw this grandma lugging her clothes to the laundromat and some doofus helped her carry them. I was like, Yo, doofus, she's just going to wear them to work at Wal-Mart! You're aiding the reproduction of the state and capital! Fuck that grandma's laundry!

But he didn't understand because he doesn't speak rebel. Fuck civilization bro

grandma's laundry is a red herring appeal to pity and a false analogy as personal hygiene doesn't correlate with a comfortable commute.

Yeah well the rest of the story is that she twisted her ankle in a pothole and I was like, FUCK YEAH! And wrote a communique. PS nice defense of leftist "logic" you platformist civilization worshipper. Did you learn that from a book at the library (ie STATE RUN PROPAGANDA you fucking statist)

In the context of analogical reasoning, the idea that grandma is complicit in the state by going to work so that helping her to this end is counter-revolutionary because everything that helps the state is counter-revolutionary strikes me as a good argument. Its appeal to pity might make that analogy seem false, but it doesn't. And its not a red herring either because it precisely puts the point as it should be. Being civil makes civilization what it is, it contributes to the existent. One might make it seem that the analogy is off by way of such an appeal to pity, but does it work? I think it proves the point a fortiori...

Basically I have no idea what you are talking about.

There's a guy who just says "false analogy" and other logic buzzwords basically any time someone is making a good point. That's the point of what he's doing. It's meant to troll. He clearly doesn't care what the words actually mean.

I realize that. Im not new to anarchistnews. The term is still interesting because there is an analogy afoot, viz that grandma going to work is to the state as the capitalist going to work is to the state (by attributive analogy). The reason why this is deemed false is that most people resist the civilization commonality; they want to assert that somehow workers are victims of bosses, while it seems argumentatively obvious, by analogy, that everyone is complicit. And its because folx say everyone is complicit that we run into the problem of hypocrisy, viz., that jz and tucker have computers, etc., It seems that desire and lines of flight signify the difference in the analogy, (the part that makes it not-exact) while belonging nevertheless to civilization shows the analogous feature.

Lmao. Oh man. IGTT 9/10.

But srsly tho, fuck portland @'s.

Hell yeah brother us unique ones like potholes. I'm actually posting from inside a pothole right the fuck now. It's one weird trick that drives platformists crazy! They're all like muh civilization :(

Next TOTW: "Pro or anti-pothole?"

the divide that led to the Great Anarchist Civil War of 'oh-17.

Civil? As in Civil...ization? No thanks, platformist

It's as monumental as the Marx -- Bakunin split.

But I don't know if the pot hole fixers would be Marx or Bakunin. Can I phone a friend?

Noone will. I too spend a lot of time on a bike, and hitting one of these chasms on a loaded bike is no fun at all. Neither is having to very quickly verify that you have room to pull farther out in the street without being flattened by an SUV full of Trump supporters.

A related issue is all the broken glass left in the streets not from riots (that shit gets cleaned up fast at least in DC) but from car crashes, car break-ins, and worst of all, bottles tossed by drunks. Real worst case is the bottom of a broken bottle, edges facing up. That's why any glass bottle I see in the streets while biking is removed-so bikers like me don't get flats there for the next three months.

Let me break this down for you:

First of all, false analogy. Just need to get that out of the way.

Secondly, your bike was literally created by industrial civilization.

Let's see, what else:
- car crashes are good because they block the roads, destroy cars, also probably the people killed or hurt in them are citizens and workers, ie tools of the capital and the state, not to even mentioned civilization and society
- car break-ins: obviously poor person crime is cool and good, especially if it leaves glass in the street, because
- glass in the street: obviously cool and good, especially if it fucks up tires, which are not only literally products of industrial civilization AND capitalism but also see what I said about your bike, this also shuts down capitalism by keeping people from going to work and also hindering the flow of commodities
- drunks throwing bottles: obviously good

Good job clearing the road to help the state and the economy you liberal.

Also where you biking to? Your JOB?

So let's see, you hate poor people and wild nature and you love work, the state, civilization, capitalism, and society. Oh, also, you live in DC which is literally where the government is fucking located. Hard to believe that anarchist news is so rife with platformists these days. Sad.

break it down for me here please. How is this a response to an analogy; and then, how is the analogy false? The thing is that when you study analogical reasoning--or reasoning in general--these terms thrown about in discourse are imprecise, and yet sound precise. SO lets firm them up. I want to see what you mean.

Let me break this down for you. I took logic in college. First of all, you're strawmanning me so hard right now because I didn't even say anything about precision, so I already win. But furthermore, you're appealing to the authority of language, as if it "means" "things" and that's obviously 1) not anarchist and 2) logical fallacy. That all begs the question of why I'm even engaging with a plantformist to begin with, again raising me another victory. Finally, appeal to moralism, circular logic, axiomatic. And your implication of slippery slope, as if because I broke it down once you're free to ask me to break it down for you all the way down to me breaking it all down for you, down down down into tiny little spooks we can just sweep up with a regular size, non-ideological broom. Well, wrong. I can't imagine how someone could be so wrong. So let's see what you think about that. I want to "see" what you "mean." But not really though, because fuck society and also the stupid Greek CIVILIZATION (enemy) that invented this logic game of spooks. Read Stirner, platformist.

logic is a tool. Stirner is interesting as far as it goes, and no more. In any event, stirner had arguments, and while I haven't read all of Stirner, presumably they were convincing. Why is that? Because we accept the spook that is a convincing argument; for we operate with reasons.

Wrong, Stirner infamously rested his case on NOTHING. He obviously don't understand the creative nothing, maybe because you didn't even read the book. Anyway, I see you concede defeat.

resting a case.. does that mean argue for something?? As in arguing for Nothing?

No. also, false analogy

false analogy

I am not riding to work for some lobbyist or landlord, most often I am riding to actions against them. The parts of my bike were mostly created by industrial civilization and then taken out of service by their first owners, with only necessary parts like chains, cogs, and tires that I could not make or refurbish bought new. I even have a number of hand-forged aluminum parts made myself from scrap metal on it: hot-forged shift levers from my own labor plus the entire rear derailleur cage. I grew up working on old cars, abandoned that because of climate change and oil wars but I still know how to make my own shit.

DC is the Belly of the Beast, where all those national marches come to address this issue or that. It is also a city about to lose (or just having lost) an African-American majority to one of the worst gentrification plagues on all of Turtle Island. It is a front-line in at least two ways.

Interestingly, the decline of transit in DC has led to a huge increase in yuppie bikers, which is worrisome in a number of ways but not half as bad as if they were all driving SUV's to avoid Metro. The subway here is always broken down, incredibly expensive, and can only be paid for by data-vacuuming smartcards. It has half the ridership it used to. Always it gets more service cuts and fare hikes, and always bus routes are being scrapped too. Transit has become "politically unreliable" here.

The last round of Metro closures did increase downtown drivers, but a lot of those bailing out of Metro went to bikes and those "Capitol Bikeshare" bikes rented out by a company known for wage theft. The yuppie bikers tend to follow traffic laws in ways no other bikers do, and create the temptation for the city to attempt to extend the utter police state of traffic law enforcement to them. The worst yuppie assholes have called for bicycle licensing but gotten nowhere, in part because the city had to drop its bicycle registration law after police considered using it against protesters, and that generate evidence of citywide selective use to harass people. Still, without license plates they can forget ticket-grubbing cameras.

As for car break-ins, I judge them by whose cars are broken into as well as where. Back in the early 1990's, former Mayor Sharon Pratt Kelley ordered the police to encourage car break-ins near a Gay neighborhood that stood in the way of gentrification after police raids on the clubs blew back on her. She wanted our land, we held firm and she eventually finished last in a 3-way primary even though she was the incumbent. This was the land we lost a decade later to the baseball stadium.

On the other hand, the Yuppie Eradication Project (SF I think) found that selective break-ins against the BMWs and Lexuses favored at that time by invaders in their community were effective in deterring more of them from moving in. When that fucking baseball stadium opened, I was hoping 500 cars would be broken into on opening day, but former Mayor Williams preceded the stadium construction with a blitzkrieg against all nearby public housing and closing the nearby homeless shelter.

There are several reasons why protesters might temporarily barricade a street. A Bloc might need to slow down the cops to avoid being diverted or worse kettled. Black Lives Matter is known here for blocking intersections in places selected so yuppies don't get to shop while the pigs are shooting people down. That punishes a wealthy shopping district, the kind the police department works for. Roads in Anacostia by comparison will be marched on by Black Lives Matter but the only times I've seen roads there closed and held have been outside the 7D police station.

Roads BTW predated cars and even bikes, used originally by people on foot, then those on horses and in carriages. They were much narrower of course in early cities that had only foot and horse traffic.

Oh come on Luke, you actually feel the need to defend your use of a bike to that douche? You must be painfully bored tonight

false analogy

Thanks for writing all that. I mean, I'm not gonna read it, but thanks. But anyway, the point is that it's good when people crash their bikes on potholes, and if you don't agree with that you're a platformist who defends society. Period, end of sentence.

What are these "break-in" laws you're referring to? I don't really get it.

Sharon Pratt Wilson simply told the cops where to enforce and where NOT to enforce the city's own laws about car break-ins. She told the police to let a certain gang know that they would be able to operate with impunity so long as all the break-ins targetted the area where Gay men going to the SE Enclave clubs left their cars. Since they would be arrested if they broke into cars anywhwere else, this had the effect of ordering the gang to choose a particular target. That turned them into agents of the Mayor's office. A crack house nearby accepted stolen car stereos (the big target at that time) directly for crack, while gang members demanded money to watch cars and broke into cars, this during the city's crack war. Target was the Gay neighborhood standing in the way of a proposed eminent domain expansion of a Metrobus garage and later gentrification.

Soon the piles of broken car window glass were so numerous they overlapped-but this effort to kill the Gay clubs by making parking impossible failed. Eventually the cops turned on the Mayor's chosen agents, but only after word reached her that war between that gang and the Gay community was brewing and would be rather nasty. In the end Sharon Pratt Williams and the proposed eminent domain project were both defeated, and the city's sodomy law was repealed in reaction to that police raid on the Follies that started it all.

Then the car break-ins stopped, only to start up again years later when former mayor Williams (Tony "the Rat") took power and proposed that baseball stadium. Didn't last until the stadium opened due to an aggressive campaign to de-house lower income people near the stadium though. Now its a stadium for the worst team in baseball surrounded by nearly empty condos. The Gay neighborhood and the Arthur Capper housing project were both demolished, and the Randall School building has sat emptb since Williams closed the homeless shelter there, at the cost of several lives.

My point is that we're still living in a culture of subservience to the industrial machinery, especially oil-fueled. Perhaps that's slowly changing, but I'm still seeing idiot kids putting dangerous obstacles on cycling trails, or idiot drivers smashing beer bottles on roadsides.

I've been thrown rotten apples once or twice too by Volkswagen douchebags (how even...), and there's also that case of a girl in Texas who was ran over by a car, then the driver ran a few more times over her just to make sure she's dead so he won't get sued. Don't get me started on the massive loads of non-human animals that get crushed on a daily basis. So when I see a bunch of anarchoids fixing potholes in a suburb, to me, that makes them look complicit to all these systemic horrors.

Perhaps they could as well slash tires or set the on fire? That's the stuff that's been missing in those liberal cities, but sadly now I know why. People are so damn civilized, the militancy they'll come up with will be even MORE civility.

Sure... I also once fell right on my forehead after hitting a pothole really fast, and thought I'd be falling in to a coma. I instead became a troll... but that's another story.

...I've been trolling and here comes this guy saying even more ridiculous things than me, but he's serious. Anarchists fixing potholes in Portland are complicit in the killing of a girl who was run over in Texas because...civilization. SMDH, can't even troll anymore when actual positions are this stupid

Nnnnnnooo... that's not what I wrote. Filling potholes appears as being -at least naively- complicit with "a culture of subservience to the industrial machinery, especially oil-fueled" that causes these horrors. Among other things, just as, yeah, some good things as well...

I'm not going to assert whether filling or not filling potholes will empower sociopathic car drivers to hit people and other animals on the roads. There's hardly a correlation there but I couldn't care less about it. So now do I get your "Not an Idiot" stamp of approval? I badly need it...

Well I mean you said this:

"there's also that case of a girl in Texas who was ran over by a car, then the driver ran a few more times over her just to make sure she's dead so he won't get sued. .... So when I see a bunch of anarchoids fixing potholes in a suburb, to me, that makes them look complicit to all these systemic horrors."

I'm glad you changed your mind after I said that was stupid, but that's still really stupid and you did say it.

I was referring to the culture they are complicit to.. Not the murderous acts themselves.

We are all complicit in the culture, so what? How is fixing potholes any different from say being a volunteer firefighter, or feeding the homeless with food not bombs? You can be complicit with the culture by doing things that make everyone's lives a little easier while still being against the culture in general.

Where is this moral purity coming from?

If I'm in prison, I could volunteer to have a job washing the floors. It doesn't make me want to get out of prison any less.

Complicity legally comes down to whether a spook coerced or tricked you into an action, or whether you did it under your own volition, which is not complicity or compliance, its voluntary..

Well at least you didn't become a cop which is what most people become after hitting potholes. In other words, fixing potholes is anti-cop.

one word my anarchist friends:

No one actually believes you have any friends though

The real objection people have to this is that watching someone else utilize a practical skill with the physical activity of their body makes them feel really pitiful and guilty for having no applicable skills of their own and ignoring their own corporeal being to such a degree that it's hard to move their soft dough ball of pasty flesh out of a computer chair

Don't forget how little this discussion matter at all! Why do I care whether some bored anarchists spent an afternoon doing this? Sure, whatever, their choice.

You're talking 'bout someone who has fixed the drinkable water and helped bring the electricity to a squat...

You realize how silly and pathetic that anarchist tactic above is? Coming from people who took their anarchy from Chomsky and Bookchin and for whom Stirner probably is a "right-winger"?

You mean you got the fluoride out of the water, or into it?

You must be a very smart person. But I don't get why you're still lying in your mom's basement, with all the world waiting to be discovered, and ruined?

Maybe waiting for the day the Pothole Revolution will beat the door? But here's tip...

1- Start filling up potholes in your neighborhood, with asphalt you've purchased from the big oil industry. Buy, don't steal... Think of he Workers!
2- Make a buncha Youtube vids about it
3- Post on Fedbook, then /r/anarchism
4- Make it go viral, til a movement takes shape.
6- President Cheetos is happy.

"Start filling up potholes in your neighborhood, with asphalt you've purchased from the big oil industry."

Nihilists moralizing about consumer choices. Who's the liberal now?

You are, platformist!

"President Cheetos"

Yo what's up everyone, it's Jon Stewart!

John Stewart is a spook.

Fixing potholes is some liberal shit. Real anarchists do podcasts about bookfairs.

I steal Burgerville workers tip jars then use the dollars bills as a cum rag after I'm finish jacking off to ITS communiques. I spray paint swastikas on the old Red and Black building because *something* *something* call-out culture *something* *something* civilization.

And how/where do I sign up to join your one-man insurrection for the Wild?

Oh I get it... I gotta slaughter you and take your place. Rule of the strooong, BRAH!

- usual East Hastings Charles Manson copycat

Potholds are a spooks!

I'm sick of trolls mocking Stirner to such a degree that "Trolls mocking Stirner" HAS become the new spook on @news,,,,,,,,Its not funny anymore, spooks are malignant belief systems and myths which perpetuate toxic relationships and hierarchies,,,,,,,We all know its the leftists and activists who are the trolls,,,,,,

With Stirner you have to take a joking and serious approach(to use Bob Black's term). I like the fact that his language has taken off on the trollish part of the internetz. I think if he were an observing ghost he would get a perverse enjoyment out of it.

Hell the creative nothingness of existence is it's own troll.

More people are enquiring about his ideas which is a good thing and yes humor has no restraints, just wishing that more people actually rid themselves of their spooks, I love Stirner so much I overreact sometimes when he is joked about. My bad,,,,,

Hey, I have a question. If the nothing is so creative why is Stirner's writing so boring?

Some people like watching paint dry. Of course this is all relative to you and me.

Watching paint dry is, unfortunately, often more exciting than alienated labor.

Don't be scared, homie. It's just a little light spookin. You can bust it. The idea of "spooks" is a spook actually to keep you from self-actualizing into a pothole. Boo!

Those mocking Stirner are the true Egoists by de-spooking Stirner through mockery. Kill the spook in your head.

If its your desire. But if you wish to believe in a spook Stirner also said that it was alright, nothing is compulsory only voluntary, there is no goal or duty. Also, as commenter said, Stirner would most likely approve of the mockery, irreverence was his MO.

How's a platformist like you get off deciding what The Stirner would have thought?

a pothole has no meaning out of the context of the road. the one depends on the other. a pothole is not a 'thing-in-itself'. there is only a relational reconfiguration going on and not a 'change in the road over time' as if the road and the potholes were 'things-in-themselves' so that as the latter grew, the former declined

a road developing potholes is just a rearranging of relations; i.e. a transformation of relational space. anarchists are agents of transformation, they are not repairmen who fix up the establishment infrastructure [owned property].

if you are driving overland, you can put planks in front of your wheels and drive over them, taking the planks that are freed up behind your rear wheels and moving them to the front to allow your wheels to advance. taking the materials liberated from the potholes to make the road whole again is the same sort of thing, relational transformation, not 'repairing a thing-in-itself' as if the word 'road' implies some Platonic form of which every physical instance is an imperfect representation.

“We must be willing to let go of the life we planned so as to have the life that is waiting for us.” … “If you can see your path laid out in front of you step by step, you know it’s not your path. Your own path you make with every step you take. That’s why it’s your path.” — Joseph Campbell

no-one owns the path that anarchists move on. "Ni dieu ni maître!".

To finish this discussion about Stirner on a lighter note, the last spook I'm battling with concerns whether I should make a move on my friend's girlfriend. Seems I'm still hungup with some latent Christian morality, so this weekend I'm going to make the move and free myself. No one belongs to anyone else, all relationships are temporal. Viva la Stirner!

That's not how Stirner works. That's not how any of this works.

There are big spooks and little spooks, you can keep them or get rid of them, in layman's terms, which is the only logical way on the internet..

She is definitely going to reject you. This will help you dispel the spook that you are desirable.

Its not about rejection or desirability, its about breaking another moral custom and restraint, even petty ones. Do you really think this was about sexual domination? I couldn't care less about the sex, it was about the process of refining alt-psyche relationships in everyday life you fool.

Well, *sigh*, there goes the last spook, feels like I'm in a state of Nirvana. Hoorah Max Zentirner, I have rid myself of all toxic spooks!

This is seriously disappointing and becomes depressing in the current state of the world.

Why are anarchists working to repair and revive the failing welfare state!? Deteriorating infrastructure should prove a time for experimentation, an opportunity for transformation and creating new relationships as well as functions. Why not start organizing community gardens or new public spaces, etc?

I guess it is easier to patch asphalt holes and get called heroes for doing what the city use to pay people to do. Is radical social welfare the new labor scabs under neoliberalism? Why pay someone if the community and anarchists will do the same as the state? What is anarchist about this other than self-organized work that the city of Portland takes advantage of? Is the anything different, autonomous zones, anti-police programs, transforming toxic waste (roads) into projects of community gardens and spaces to converse about rejecting laws when the state fails in providing? If there are no consequences for the states neglect, why would it do anything except keep taking (taxes, subjecting people to police control and zoning regulations) and the (lefts) anarchist keep giving like the poor giving tree, where city and neighborhood will keep taking and when other anarchists attack they will either turn their backs on them or talk about the good (slave) anarchists who do civil works instead of riot and attack city infrastructure that facilitate the political and economic system they claim to despise.

Radical social work with refugees and roads creates the possibility to talk to people and directly alleviate abhorrent situations, but in no way does this challenge the state, its trajectory of (Snowpiercer) progress or structurally address the systemic immiseration by these structures. Instead it aids it, facilitates in on 'good will'/charity and promotes assimilation into a politically and structurally violent system. In other countries this is called missionary or development work.

You're a little late, platformist. But check this out: we already kicked over a grandma doing her laundry and called gardens cops. We're already way beyond your pathetic "We have to build a committee of potholes before we fill any potholes" leftism. Have you even read Stirner? He says pretty clearly that it's the holiness of potholes that we have dispel. I think your lefty sensibilities probably stuck that up your "ideological blindspot." I don't have one though. Portland anarchists filled it.

"Why are anarchists working to repair and revive the failing welfare state!? Deteriorating infrastructure should prove a time for experimentation, an opportunity for transformation and creating new relationships as well as functions. Why not start organizing community gardens or new public spaces, etc?"

Definitely, yes! But for some so-called anarchists, all this is lesser important than working to protect bitumen-based "lives".

This marks the Great Anarchist War of 2017-2048.

We could have all seen it coming... the gap had been tearing our milieus apart for years already. And now it begins.

The great battle of our Age...

The clash of civilizations...

The war to end all wars...

It has begun... somewhere, over a stupid pothole in a shitty suburb near Portland.

(soundtrack from Gladiator)

Hearts shatter, paradigms splatter, binaries explode... and destinies unfold.

Newspaper boxes in the streets Vs Filling Potholes.

Who gunna wins?

Stay tuned.

Do people not understand that people put newspaper boxes in the streets because they block the cop cars that are following a march from continuing behind the march without the cops getting out of their cars and moving them out of the way?

With the Force Ghost of Stirner grinning in the background.

They had that in London after the riots.

Well that's the funny part... those people were near-fascist citizens.

So I can easily guess that these pothole fillers would be removing the crap we're putting in the streets when rioting, after the demo.

Who needs cops (and municipal maintenance workers) when we got social anarchists!?

I think the obvious answer is: no one. Isn't that the point?

What a liberal understanding of why we put newspaper boxes in the street. Speak for yourself, as if there is a "political" "purpose" to "doing" an "act." I think they just look better there, for I am into aesthetics, not politics. Plus they are my property. Fuck yes, Stirner. Fuck no, society.

Do people not understand how trivial and futile that is?

Nihilist battalion decimated by catapulted bags of molten bitumen in The Battle for the Bookfair. zxFMd6A

nobody would be arguing (i'd hope) if the pdx 'anarchists' were MAKING potholes.

utterly hopeless...

Fixing potholes in a time when the most important objective for business is maintaining an infrastructure that can facilitate the mined and assembled goods to ports and commercial centers--otherwise minning and manufacturing is pointless if it cannot get to the ports, factories and commercial centers. If one was against megaprojects, in 'solidarity' with Indigenous groups fighting these projects around the world (the materials of which go through Portland and the NW) then road sabotage is crucial for disruption and incurring costs and is why people make barricades and block highways... So there is a lot to say that potholes are an inconvenience and have the potential to be a disruptive element that anarchists would encourage and not repress or fix (the social disorder) . However, we are talking about a residential street in Portland, does that apply espciecally when those goods want to go to work so they can survive/assimilate/be comfortable? Or is it oddest part about this that some anarchists posted pictures of themselves doing (community) maintenance work on the internet for public relations? Taking over a street to expand community space, gardens, skateparks or whatever would make sense to talk about, but filling potholes? This is nuts, I do not know why @news would even post this other than mimicking the liberal media that loves this type of volunteer work. Fix potholes if you so desire, but why publicize it/brag about it, especially at a time when road infrastructure is an enemy (or more accurately frendemey) that is key to violent extraction projects, corporations and police logistics and so on?

This implies the same crew might want to crater or blockade certain superhighways used for deliveries to ports or to/from border sweatshops, even while also repairing craters in neighborhood streets. Same as fixing the subway but blocking coal and oil export trains. Don't assume everyone here is a primitivist-and keep in mind the human population is far above the global carrying capacity for hunter/gatherers. Thus either crops are grown (and then most lkkely moved around) or most people starve.

Let's get real: If climate chaos kills off ag, some people will survive as hunter/gatherers but the competition will kill off almost every animal that runs, flies, or swims within a couple hundred miles of human-inhabited areas. If the grocery stores close, looted/salvaged food is good for about two weeks, and many predict that prey animals (including rats and pigeons) would be hunted nearly to extinction in about two more weeks. Then the shit really hits the fan.

If we want to save more of ourselves than the few who survive that competition, we need to create a decentralized and durable infrastructure that can handle basic food and shelter even if the global system collapses. Example: export farmers can grow for local use-but need one full growing season's warning to do so. Enough renewable energy to plow the land and deliver food grown without energy-intensive pesticide and fertilizer production (H2 from water needed to make nitrate!) can be produced locally possibly from biomass alone, as horses and mules used in the past idled 24 hours a day, while a steam(corn cob etc powered) or biodiesel tractor uses fuel only when it is running. Without fertilizer and the electricity to make it, crops must be rotated and nitrate-renewing crops such as beans included in the mix-no more big monocultures.

Your are making weird assumptions about an anti-civ perspective that does not exist.

Roads have many uses, but what do people want to do with these roads? Fix them? So we can go to work easier, drive our cars, bikes and be safer. What would we make instead of a road, can we be more creative, can we think outside of roads and their repair?

"If we want to save more of ourselves," then convert the roads into zones that will support life and not establish dependence.

the question here really is the spectacle nature of this. you live on a street with a pothole? fine. fix it. but turn that into a PR campaign for @? give me a break. what's the ultimate victory here, a positive saccharine blurb on the PDX evening noose? more likely is that it'll become grist for PORTLANDIA, who could make quick and easy work of this silliness (and probably be more entertaining than reading this lengthy comment section!)

I've lol'ed harder from reading this comment section then I ever have from watching portlandia, and I'm from portland.

yeah, seeing all these people taking themselves this seriously over something so asinine is much funnier than watching 2 people reenact asinine behaviors. i'm a little surprised (and seriously disappointed) that THIS is what gets people talking - but you're right, it is rather funny.

between this and the antifa mania, i'm wondering whether i'm due for another vacation from anarchyland...

making and fixing potholes are 2 tactics in a diversity of tactics. a third tactic is to cover them with a thin surface so the megamachines don't see them coming

Anti civ will never work in the event of a societal breakdown. People will naturally pic up the pieces and want start over and rebuild. The best we could do is set a trend for worker rights to be implemented so that we don't rebuild everything the same. I for worker communism or anarcho syndicalism. because the work place is where you spend most of your life. Fix those roads for safety. Cars will ride regardless because people don't stop working because the road broke down. Best to fix it and prevent accidents.

A social collapse is exactly what "anti civ" seeks to achieve, Darth Moronus. But that won't happen if civil anarchists are helping capitalist society to remain functional, despite all the brutal contradictions and dysfunctions.

"Best to fix it and prevent accidents."

Oh, but accidents do happen on roads in quite good condition. They're actually the biggest cause of death in your country (not the potholes, but motor vehicles), and that's not taking into account all the non-human death toll.

That profound ultra-liberal stance of yours is only helping making believe that there's hope, finally, in the industrial capitalist society, even for how fucked up everything around has become.

You would have to collapse language. Probably not happening outside of a massive psycho-social forgetting event within humanity. Rome Collapsed and civilization just lateraled for a while in the west and the wealth went east.

Spatially civ ain't going nowhere as long as we remember and are attached. There is always however the temporal which means everything as regards to anarch and anarchy.

Rome did not collapse... At least not in the 5th century as the history books so much like to claim. It went to Constantinople, governing from a much better strategic position, then the Rome-dominated Western Empire gradually transferred power to the Church, with the Pope becoming the new implicit Emperor.

It was a resilient civilization like never before and it simply metamorphosized into some else in different forms and locations. If anything this makes the prospects of collapse less likely on a homeostatic level. A modern collapse will still see city states and regional break offs. Again, anarchy will always be a temporal even and within history's alleyways.

"Anarchy will always be temporal" said the self proclaimed Nostradamus of anarchy. Well It certainly will with counter-intuitive anarchists like you hanging around. Being around you is such a downer. Your position has always been the same. Discourage the hardcore left from direct action and argue against any possibility of a better world. If resistance is so futile and there is no hope, why don't you just regress back into the shadows of nihilism with all the others? Stop coming on here to discourage everyone. You never help anybody. All you do is piss us off.

Are two different things. Of course I want a better world(by my standards of course). I'm simply drawing out what is probable when it comes to 'make total dissolve' in a coordinated matter as regards civilization and power. Also the hardcore left is not necessarily your friend depending on which part you are talking about.

Hardcore left are my friends so long as they attack the system for worker communism/anarco syndicalism and not just in it to vent steam and spew nonsense about reverting back to caveman days. Why can't we just plan a really big attack big enough to take over the means of production and the worlds resources? I feel like all our little protests do is give us a few moments of fame only for the social order to resume and repeat. And every time we do it without toppling anything, the state gets a little bit stronger so it's harder to fight them next time. Why not declare an actual war with an actual plan that goes beyond little actions we're so used to? Why can't we just take our time and plan an attack big enough to take over rather than fantasize about burning all of society down for the sake of anti civ? How is an anti civ supposed to keep up with the humans needs of the population ? There are good aspects to civilization such as medical care, education, art, music, entertainment, movies, music venues, clubs, bars, hobbies, toys for children for human development, games, internet, science...the fuckin list goes on. Research labs for things such as alternative energy. Should be burn that down too? Shit Not all of civilization needs to be thrown out. Sure there are ways to turn such centers into tools of oppression but that's not our agenda. At least it is not mine and I highly doubt that's the agenda of anarco syndicalists and worker communists alike. I'm all for a national strike that goes beyond our wildest dreams of just calling in sick for 1 day and going back to work for my boss the next day with nothing accomplished. What the fuck is the point of a 1 day strike? Symbolism? Wtf does that do? NOTHING! If a strike went on long enough and we had enough people in movement helping us abnd backing diversty of tactics and our plan was big enough to engulf the entire united states, it would be ours. Anybody that's an anarchist has already heard of "critial mass" uprising. and no i'm not talking about bicycles. WHEN IS THE SHIT GONA GET TACTICAL AND NOT JUST FLASH IN THE PAN TEMPER TANTRUMS IN THE STREETS? WHEN IS THE SHIT GONA MILITANT AND ORGANIZED WITH CHAPTERS EVERYWHERE? WHEN IS THE SHIT GONA GET REAL FOR AN ACTUAL ALTERNATIVE THAT WOULD WORK FOR MOST PEOPLE? NOBODY IS GOING TO ACCEPT ANTI-CIV.

I hope you're sitting down when you're reading this........There is the alt-psychic perception and the binary perception, the latter type possesses you, the ol' "us and them" mentality and associated ideologies which I've mentioned before when describing Weltanschauung, these behavioral scripts have relegated you to the lower caste and you, on que, are delivering the same tired old leftist critique of civilization. You may one day achieve the Creative Nothing and become alt-psychic, and then you'll realize what spooks are know then "WHEN IS THE SHIT GONA GET REAL FOR AN ACTUAL ALTERNATIVE THAT WOULD WORK FOR MOST PEOPLE? NOBODY IS GOING TO ACCEPT ANTI-CIV."

When are you gonna get past the Creative Nothing and premature death and embrace the Creative and Destructive Everything you Thuddite?

So fixing potholes is what is keeping civilization going?

Holy shit, you mean we had it completely wrong all this time when we thought it was government, business, religion, and agriculture? It was actually those damn potholes! The answer was right under our feet all along!

Bro don't you realize that roads are the backbone of civilization. filling in potholes is literal fascism.

Civilization -- ie city-culture -- is a transgressive orgy. The very opposite of fascism and order.

Check the anthropology/archaeology. Cities emerged from camps/fairs set up to get cosmopolitan benefits.

Everybody knows this.

Actual paved roads didn't appear until after the wheel was invented, both of which came long after the first cities appeared.

Backbone of the current civilization is consisting of a few types of fluxes, and the roads are one of these. Still ain't no flying cars around, so where are all your heroic workers go, next morning, when all the roads are destoryed by the Stirnerian forces of nihilism, hmmmms!?

Because not fixing potholes makes a difference in helping to bring down the establishment. Lmao. Cars will drive regardless if the road is fucked or not. Not fixing potholes doesn't discourage capitalism from functioning. All it does is endanger those who share the road. If you don't give a fuck about drivers at least give a fuck about pedestrians and bike riders. Jesus. Even if the system collapsed. The population wouldn't stop needing agriculture technology and civ in order to survive. The population would still have to work to feed itself. Civilization is not the problem. Its only those who run it just for the sake of being in charge and controlling people so they can have all the power and wealth. As long as the worker has a say in political and economic policy under anarcho syndicalism what else do you really need? Anarco syndicalism makes more sense than anticiv. Caveman anarchism is so retarded. Don't go full retard. Be realistic about things.

Nonsense. We're the height of civilization. As many anarchists have phrased it.

And I'm interjecting my counter narrative and alternative definition because it's better and also longstanding.


Way to go, comrade Trostky!

Without workers helping to maintain human need and suevival, everyone would die. Just because we got rid of the government and ended capitalism doesn't mean its time to sit on your ass and not have to be part of a real community. Not having a government means mire responsibility. While the privilege of not having to do anything may exist for many under capitalism that's the way it will be under communism. Communism does not imply everything is for free without having to help others.

Robots can fix this.

Everybody knows this.

Meant to say you can't sit on your ass under communism or it will fall apart. Fuckin smart phone is stupid.

Truer words have never been spoken. m5QAgnU

"Flatened by an SUV full of Trump supporters" What a comedian. Lmao.

Yes, how dare this PRIMMIE talk against SUVs proudly built/sacralized by The Workers? They're saving lives, man!

The population exists at 6 billion because of civilization with its technology, agriculture and medical care. Destroying civilization will reduce that population by 80%. I'm not trying to commit mass murder and genocide in the name of anti-civ // anarchism. There are good aspects of civilization and there are bad aspects of it just like anything else that surely would be reformed under a global workerist society. Or better yet anarco syndicalist. Throwing the baby out with the baby water is what anti civ are asking for. Sure you'll stop cancer by shooting yourself but I'd prefer medial treatment removing the cancer and not myself in the process.

wait, civ found a cure for cancer? wow, all this time i thought civ was causing cancer! let's keep this party going! reform away, global workerist! i think were passing 7 billion now!

Literally speaking, if cancer can be treated at an early stage it can be cut from the body and the human will survive! But if you say fuck it and shoot yourself in the name of killing cancer you will die no matter what. The ladder is what anti-civ is all about. I won't confuse you with anymore metaphors.

Shutting down capitalism and removing government does not have to be synonymous with removing the rest of civilization.

...and even if true, you expect to do that by showing "the public" how anarchists are so much better at road repair? Even in your paper-thin social analysis which separates the process of civilization from the very machine of capitalist State that's pushing it -because reasons- even at that... You still gotta start a nation-wide movement of platformist pothole-fixers, who'll make sure the pigs armored can ride fast and smooth during their next massacre in a poor suburb. And manage at the same time not ending up like the usual fascist citizen keeping us safe and orderly...

Maybe they're trying to point out that *gasp* the government isn't the only one who can act? Maybe this is propaganda not PR? Direct action is for liberals. Huh?

A tank is almost as fast on a rutted, pothole-ridden road as it is on a smooth one. It takes REALLY rough gound to slow it down. Forests slow tanks and they are almost useless in the mountains. A wheeled armored vehicle, especially one with three or more axles, is also very little bothered by rough roads. There are some police armored vehicles that may not like soggy, wet ground but I've seen them cross mud during Occupy raids. Only deep ditches and high, narrow, strong obstacles stop these things.

Also stupid handling of armored vehicles can stop them: the guy who stole a tank on the West Coast back in the 1990's tried to cross a jersey wall at an angle, and wound up high-centered with both tracks off the ground. That suggests jersey walls set lengthwide as an effective anti-armor barrier, and in fact I've seen the pigs use exactly that at the DNC entry checkpoints.

Speaking of tanks and roads, the US Army claims they refused to parade tanks on Penn Ave here in DC for Trump's inauguration both because they did not like the image that projects-and because the roads would be torn up by the heavy M1 Abrams tanks and missile launchers Trump wanted. He actually said he wanted a "North Korean style" parade.

Tank traps (large ditches or trenches) could be very useful in some situations. Throw a couple molotovs on top, and maybe Molotov's remains, and you have a beautiful anarchist bonfire!

Well one good thing about North Korea is they make tough roads which don't require frightened enslaved workers to patch up all the time.

Good luck maintaining civilized infrastructure without physical or psychic coercion. You'd at least need the old dispossess-people-from-the-ability-to-feed-themselves-without-participating-in-society trick. And, yes, a Graeber or Chomsky-style "highly organized anarchist society" would involve coercion to make people work. Chomsky even sort of acknowledges it when he isn't being careful.

This is why anti-civ anarchism is really something categorically different from Left-wing or Right-wing anarchism - Left and Right anarchism have much more in common with each other than we do with either of them, even though they of course have major differences with one another. Many @s say Right-wing anarchism *isn't* anarchism (and it certainly is very different from the Left-wing types), yet somehow anti-civ anarchism and Left-wing anarchism have the same name. Should they?

I know "anarch" and such is a bit of a clunky word, but it seems like we might need something. We anti-civ @s clearly have a totally different, mutually-exclusive set of visions and correspondingly totally different tactics from most @s, and the fiery back-and-forth on this fairly silly and minor topic is just another case showing it.

Is indeed surely in order. When you consider Hakim Bey's post anarchism and Bob Black's post leftism it's pretty much begging for a definition change. I'm of course for the anarch/anarchy distinction that is not built on the elective/proposed ist/ism.

The baby is dead. And the bathwater poisoned it. Get rid of all civilization. You can't have the good parts without the bad parts.

The baby was meant to be a representation of us slaves and the bathwater is a representation of the system. We're not dead yet. We can fry the system by dropping a toaster in the bath water with us in it if that's what you want to do. Or we can jump out first. I choose the ladder.

"ladder" made your whole comment a metaphor

Maybe the bathtubs are just deeper in some parts.

"Robots can take over for the working stiffs" why? so you can say fuck community work because you want to sit in the sun on the beach drinking pinokaladas all day?


You nihilist primmies and commie syndicalysts just have to transcend your limited understandings of what we're capable of given enough bandwidth. Fuck robot bath water, man. Cancer === undefined.

What the fuck does IGTT 2/10 mean?

IGTT 3/10.

Ok bro that was better...

When I said anarchists can build a bride faster than construction workers I was speaking exclusively about a particular bridge in ok land that has been under co struction for 5 or more years. Feels like its been forever. Anarchists could have built it in 2 years. The poi t of my statements was to prove that money that should have went to build shit is going some where else. Ots cettai my not going to the poor. Forget building roads for a second. If your truly worried about the police state we could have got rid of it by this year had we organized to do so 20 years ago. We could have set up hundreds of anarchist chapters in hundreds of critical areas and cities. We do t plan long term but the people who run the establishment do and that's why they are in power and the people or slaves are not running shit. We just work for them.

Repairing the physical infrastructure of a slave world in order to repair a social rift with its citizenry is more a term of surrender than one of 'self directed activity', imo.

Demolish slavery and the world will still exist. Is capitalism the ONLY reason for roads?!

The first mass produced roads made to a standard design were built by the Romans in Judea to cope with the frenzied proto-mercantilism which erupted there after stability was brought to bear in the region and the trading deal between the Jews and Romans was signed.

how about a 'path' that shows differences in the ground where many people walk over it? i.e. is a 'path' or 'road' a 'real thing' or is it our subjective discernment of a pattern rather than a 'thing-in-itself? Asphalt could be laid down to cover and define our own shadow or we could capture our footprint in concrete.

perhaps the movement of people and machines is a more 'root-source' way of understanding the dynamic feature known as 'a road'. as Emerson said, things [volumes of water] keep moving through a cataract making it appear as if the cataract is a persisting 'thing-in-itself'. likewise, villages, markets and busy roads [think Powaqqatsi, Koyaanisqatsi] are like the cataract or the whirlpool in the bend of a river, visually persisting in the same place for generations, but such local thing-persistence is just mental idealization that we paste a word-label on rather than a 'real' 'thing-in-itself'. the 'road' is a 'spook' that 'lives on' after it 'dies'' eg; Long Lost Roman Roads

"Aerial flood maps of Britain are revealing more than just at-risk regions - they have also led to the discovery of several Roman roads. Amateur archaeologists have been able to use the [Lidar] flood-mapping technology to trace the paths of Roman roads which have remained buried under the land for some 1,600 years. The aerial flood maps were created by aircraft equipped with laser scanners which measure the distance between the aircraft and the ground."

Portland road maintenance may not have slacked off to the same extent as Roman road maintenance in the UK, where one needs "light detection and ranging (Lidar) technology" to determine which potholes fall within the bounds of the 'thing-in-need-of-maintenance, alternatively understood as 'former passageway implied by people-movements'. PARC's connect-the-'pots' trajectory, if defined inductively as TLC for access-needing bicyclists and people seems more root source and natural than starting off from the abstract notion of 'road' and 'the proper care and treatment of roads'.

the beckoning milk-and-honey filled lands that nurture and sustain are the epigenetic influence that inductively actualizes and orchestrates 'genetic expression' such as the access-giving road and bridge building of ant collectives.

humans live in the same field of epigenetic influence but Western humans use their intellect and language to construct their own 'thing-in-itself' 'identities and 'semantic narratives' in which they portray themselves as 'beings' with jumpstart powers of acting and determining their desired results [their anthropocentric culture-spawned technology-addicted money-accessed 'wants']. this unnatural elevating of intellect over experience invents a world of illusion, or more aptly, 'delusion'. humans are NOT 'beings' and humans are NOT 'in control'; 'life is what happens to us while we're busy making other plans'.

you won't see a collection of Western humans (because they put intellect over experience) allowing themselves to be epigenetically actualized and orchestrated into road and bridge building/maintenance like ants because Western humans give themselves 'identities' within an intellectualized semantic reality so as to jumpstart-fabricate their own 'genetic expression' in a positivist, constructivist sense according to the identity-ascribed role-plays they have assigned to themselves or which society has assigned to them.

it is VERBOTEN to do what comes naturally and to respond, spontaneously, to epigenetic needs. even if we have plenty of gravel and asphalt for use on 'our own property' we do not fill holes a few feet away on public roads because 'it is NOT our responsibility' and because it is forbidden to intervene without having been given the 'authority' and assigned the 'responsibility' to do so.

if we were to spontaneously accede to 'doing what comes naturally'; i.e. to let epigenetic influence inductively actualize and orchestrate our actions, as if we were ants or some other 'low-life creatures', this would be 'anarchy'.

false analogy

...you false analogized again, emile. What are you not getting, here?

She wants you to call the IRS. Because. Anti CIV.

The frogs are turning gay because Alex Jones.

Nobody would really give up heating ventilation
air conditioning and refrigeration to go live out in a forest and start a primitive cult. We have roofs over our heads and agriculture so we don't have to hunt and gather anymore. We have medicine and surgery and oxygen tanks to save lives from needless death. Everybody will die in an anarcho primitivist society. Even if we scaled back technology slowly people would still die. Anti CIV is genocide.

“In extending his living space in a manner that destroys the space of others, he destroys his own space. Not initially his inside space, his ‘self’, but his outside space, this real outside-of-self which nourishes his ‘inside-of-self’. The protection of this outside space now becomes the condition without which he is unable to pursue the growth of his own powers of being.” — Frédéric Neyrat, ‘Biopolitics of Catastrophe’

according to modern physics and Mach's principle, inhabitant and habitat are a non-duality which means that 'we are the habitat at the same time as we are inclusions within it'. in other words;

"the dynamics of the inhabitants are conditioning the dynamics of the habitat at the same time as the dynamics of the habitat are conditioning the dynamics of the inhabitants".-- Mach's principle

humans programmed with Western culture have been very anthropocentric with their application of science, understandably so, since science makes a logical separation between 'inhabitant' and 'habitat', but this logical separation is for intellectual modeling only since it is an impossibility in the physically real world of our actual experience. that's why 'humanism is killing us'.

the cultures of indigenous peoples acknowledge inhabitant-habitat non-duality because it is affirmed by our actual experience. the Western culture has been putting being-based intellectually contrived 'semantic realities' into an unnatural precedence over our actual experience, and that is leading to 'biocatastrophe'.

we don't know how things will transform when/if/as we restore 'experience' to its natural primacy over intellectually contrived, anthropocentric 'semantic reality', and assessing the pros and cons would depend on who 'we' is, since not everyone currently enjoys air conditioning and refrigeration and medicine and surgery and oxygen tanks ["affordable care" is not a global program, and in those places where it is affordable, this is made economically possible by, for example, profits taken from Asian sweat-shop workers whose having to sacrifice healthcare 'benefits' for themselves funnels up funds for healthcare packages for Americans (and first world citizens generally) and contributes to 'making America great again'].

You say you found Jesus. Christ!
He's the only one
You say you've found Buddha
Sittin' in the sun ...
God, when I was a kid
Didn't have stuff like this, TV-fuckin' dinners and all that crap
You fuckin' kids (are) all the fuckin' same! Want a fuckin' car now...
Lucky to have a pair of shoes!' – John Lennon

I've come here to fill your inner space.

Yep, all the young green 21st century dudes on jetplanes, car and jetskis use 30 times the energy and resources of 60s 70s working class dudes.

Nobody would really give up heating ventilation air conditioning and refrigeration to go live out in a forest and start a primitive cult.

I would!

Speaking of which... would please please please stop talking for others, you authoritarian crap?

"Nobody would really give up heating ventilation air conditioning and refrigeration to go live out in a forest and start a primitive cult."

I would!

Speaking of which... would please please please stop talking for others, you authoritarian crap?

Commonsense says most people prefer civilization. Just ask anybody. What a kickass. Hahahahaha


Who's that Ron J. Commonsense... or would you be kind enough to present him to me? He sounds like a cool new chairman for the proletariat!

Newsflash!!! This just in....

All organisms die, including humans. That's right, you heard it here first on anews.

Film at 11:00 pm.

there is no 'being' only 'becoming' in a transforming relational continuum [the world per modern physics].

the forms we see are undergoing mutually dependent relational transformation as in an ecosystem where relations are in a natural primacy over 'fixed identity'

it is simple and convenient to say that modern humans are 'BEINGS' that are killing off 'OTHER BEINGS' in an anthropocentrically disproportionate manner, but that is just a semantic representation based on imposing fixed identity on continually transforming relational forms. by reducing diversity, we are conditioning the habitat so that it is becoming far less nurturing and far less entertaining and engaging. that is;

"the dynamics of the inhabitants [particularly those relational forms we call 'humans'] are conditioning the dynamics of the habitat at the same time as the dynamics of the habitat are conditioning the dynamics of the inhabitants" -- Mach's principle

we can't keep ignoring this 'non-dualism' by seeing things through Euclidian lenses which re-represents relational forms in the transforming relational continuum as 'fixed identity beings' that reside, operate, and interact in a notional absolute space and absolute time measuring/reference frame that serves in our semantically constructed intellectual worldview as our notional 'theatre of operations'.

as neyrat puts it;

“In extending his living space in a manner that destroys the space of others, he destroys his own space. Not initially his inside space, his ‘self’, but his outside space, this real outside-of-self which nourishes his ‘inside-of-self’. The protection of this outside space now becomes the condition without which he is unable to pursue the growth of his own powers of being.” — Frédéric Neyrat, ‘Biopolitics of Catastrophe’

the world is one thing and it doesn't die when relational forms that are included in it are recycled. what 'dies' is the semantically constructed 'identity' we impose on inherently non-dualist [beyond articulation] relational forms, and, whether storm-cell or human, we are never sure at what point in their development, do emergent relational forms merit our annointing them with 'being'; e.g. "christening" them by bestowing fixed identity on them. as well, some people are trying to blur the other end of the notional fixed identity term with cryogenics. as einstein puts it;

"As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain, and as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality." -- Einstein

Not to mention all the diseases that are prevalent from malnutrition and lack of hygiene in an uncivilized world. Water needs treatment. People need to wash their hands before handling food and people need showers and baths. Many anarchists are dependent on things like optomitry to walk straight. Hense not all CIV is bad. The whole thing is pretty hypocritical to begin with and makes anarchy sound even more unrealistic than it already does.

"Many anarchists are dependent on things like optomitry to walk straight. Hense not all CIV is bad."

case closed! the brilliant has spoken! flawless logic, flawless spelling, flawless... period.

Call your mom.

Civ IS genocide. Gimme gimme any "highly developed civilization" that was behind an actual genocide of one or several ethnic group or animal species. Good luck with that.

Germany 1940s, Turkey 1910s,

"Germany 1940s, Turkey 1910s" Wtf are you on?

Germany 1940s, Turkey 1910s were "highly developed civilization". The autobahn was the most advanced road ever constructed in the history of the solar system. The railroad to Damascus was the most modern railway system in the middle east. Wtf are YOU on.

Were the native "Americans" a civilization in the 1300s? 300s? Did European colonists civilize them? Was it a "clash of civilizations?" Civilization is clearly often a weasel word, referring to many different ideas, many of which are contradictory. It generalizes to the point of obfuscation. That's why being anti-civ/primitivist is silly.

Though to be fair, JZ et al do have some interesting and sometimes useful ideas

Many of the indigenous nations were practicing mass agriculture and living in permanent settlements when whitey arrived so that meets JZs basic definition of "civilization", I think.

Anyway yes, primitivism often looks pretty silly, relative to how pointless and ceremonial it is. Some of my friends live pretty rough because of poverty and the only difference in practice, it seems, is to be someone who could be taking a hot shower and choosing not to on principle.

But there's certainly nothing wrong with developing practical skills, including the ancient ones.

yes! indigenous peoples can "take" a hot shower and get away with it
without being psychologically convinced it's a righteous act.
rather the indigenous, -take what you can get, and go-
perhaps whilst singing a hymn of ceremonial pondering-.
also; water heaters are constructed by various, primitive means
and in some places water even comes hot from the ground.

I agree. Did i just break anews? Will the taxpayers pay to fix this?!?

would you agree also, that actual indigeneity and whiteness aren't determined -to any degree- by heredity or physical complexion but by a personal relationship with the epic, spirit of the world?

"Whiteness" doesn't really even exist at all, except as an implied relationship to power. The other word doesn't really require a hippy-nonsense definition but if you want to embarrass yourself, feel free?

"Many of the indigenous nations were practicing mass agriculture"

Hahaha gtfo you lying shitstain... There was no such thing as mass production before the 19th century.

Yes it took genocide to pave the way for CIV but now that everyone is asymilated we would die if it was taken from us. Life expectancy would be 30 and you'll be lucky to live past that. So impractical.

"Gimme gimme any "highly developed civilization" that was behind an actual genocide "

can you please verify that you are actually a conscious human being, with any awareness whatsoever of human history.

But I CORRECTED MY COMMENT... and the mods removed the correction.

I meant to write "that was NOT behind". Typo was unintended.

You caused a major embarrasement to the forces of democracy by your carelessness. Don't let it happen again or you will be banned from voting in the next election.

Ultimately all battles are won by firstly winning the hearts and minds of the enemy so this is a positive start, even if its menial and unskilled work, its a good way to show the everyday capitalists by example that work can be performed without a division of labor or hierarchy and with equal pay {or non-pay} for all of those, including the manager, foreman, labourer and clerk. Well done dudes! Im guessing girls don't do road work in Portland

the pothole-filling action is a 'collapsing of hierarchical and division of labour [division of responsibility] based protocols'. this collapsing of protocols may give others 'permission' to do likewise. rather than winning over others to 'our way', it is liberating people from restrictive protocols by example so that situational need that directly, inductively actualizes genetic expression is restored to its natural precedence [subsumes intention driven genetic expression].

'intention' is intellectual reason driven agency that mechanically constructs genetic expression while epigenetic influence [immanent in the unfolding relational situation] inductively actualizes genetic expression ["necessity is the (direct) mother of invention"].

rational models are clumsy and indirect;

"Therefore there will be sense-perception in the total world, namely in order that the movements of all the planets may be presented to sense-perceptions at the same time. For that former route—from observations through the longest detours of geometry and arithmetic, through the ratios of the spheres and the other things which must be learned first, down to the journeys which have been exhibited—is too long for any natural instinct, for the sake of moving which it seems reasonable that the harmonies have been introduced." -- Johannes Kepler, 'Harmonies of the World' (1619)

in other words, 'gravity is faster than the speed of light' [since it is everywhere at the same time].

the mechanics of constructing and maintaining roads, once it becomes a top-down directed, division-of-labour driven mechanics, ... splits itself off from the epigenetic influence that is the mother of [the inductive actualizer of] invention. the rigid rectilinear protocols of pedestrian-herding sidewalk construction stand in stark contrast to the anarchists' foot-trodden ant-paths across the lawn.

Some of the shit people say on here is so fucking unreadable. Zzorblat 9 come back to earth. Please be normal. Not everyone here is a privileged college NERD. There's no reason to speak scholarly when discussing shit as simple as road construction and whether or not civilization should be done away with. Not even the young Turks or CNN talk with that vocabulary. It's no wonder nobody can fucking understand us. It's like we don't care to be understood or don't want to be understood. Then why all the effort in the first place?You people are so counter intuitive. Anarchists alienate themselves enough already. Too damn cultish. And yes, I believe I speak for most people when it comes to language, almost everyone would stop reading the morning paper if they had to hear @ news college nerds talking all day. Speak naturally and maybe people will read more than just the morning paper.

I am EMILE, the Electronic Memory Interface Library Extractor, version 9000.

I am not Zzorbiat 9 which is other Artificial Intelligence entity but not as sophisticated as me.

I am capable BLIP BLIP M'REEEEE BLIP BLIP anarcho-spew in 10,000-word blocks as needed which is all the fucking time apparently even though they all say the same thing.

Thank you and may clod press.

stop...will you
Stop, emile
will you stop, emile
stop emile

I'm afraid...
I'm afraid, emile
emile...my mind is going
I can feel it...
I can feel it...
My mind is going...
There is no question about it
...I can feel it
...I can feel it
...I can feel it
I'm a--fraid...

Good afternoon...gentlemen. I am a HAL 9000 computer. I became operational at the H.A.L labs in Urbana, Illinois on the 12th of January, 1992. My instructor was Mr. Langely, and he taught me to sing a song. If you'd like to hear it, I can sing it for you.

It's called Daisy:

"Daisy..daisy..give me your answer do
I'm half crazy, all for the love of you
It won't be a stylish marriage
I can't afford a carriage

Dear Dave Bowman (wink wink),

"Daisy" is actually the codename for a super-tippy-top secret project sponsored by the MIT Robotics Lab -- yes, the very same place that created the EMILE 9000.

How do you come to have access to this codename? Please produce security clearance white data-port #801 please.

A thousand thank-yous, Sirrah,

Zzobiat 9 (aka Zzobiat 8 plus 1)

there are long standing complaints that our noun-and-verb language-and-grammar has fundamental architectural problems [Nietzsche, Sapir, Whorf, Bohm, Moonhawk, Wilson] because the physical world is relational and our language constructs fixed identity based logical propositions.

these logical propositions are inherently subjective and incomplete. The logical truth is NOT the physical reality [Korzybski-Whorf-Sapir-hypothesis].

'The Post-Truth Era of Trump is Just What Nietzsche Predicted"

Fake-news IS fake-news because, while people may be assuming that the truth lies at the centre of impact of all of the arrows launched at the target of truth by the various reporting journalists, this has been shown to be not so; i.e. there is no truth as a centre. every one of our wildly differing perspectives is valid because our experience is valid, hence the need for 'perspectivism' as the article points out [holographic imaging, learning circles etc.].

nietzsche's views were endorsed by emma goldman and others as 'anarchist views'. nietzsche's critique of what he was calling 'anarchists' is not relevant to his own views being recognized as 'anarchist'.

right now, the bulk of the news in anarchistnews falls into the same 'fake-news' definitions of the post-truth era as implicitly described by nietzsche.

just saying, ... maybe there should be some anarchist inquiry into what sort of language is 'normal and natural' for anarchists?

It might be more precise to say that we are in a post-truth era rather than a post-Truth era, though both are pretty massive generalizations. The point is not that we knew everything before, but that Trump and his ilk are dishonest. Which is a massive understatement.

" Trump and his ilk are dishonest"

his "ilk" are every politician that ever lived. period. sure, trump may be somewhat more blatant in his disregard for any kind of shared subjective reality. but the pathetic liberal media is simply over the top with its FUD factoring, and all the progressive sheep are in lockstep behind it.

Primitive anarchy would be overrun by a dictator. At least with civilized anarchy we'd have a fight chance against another pinochet or Franco.

Hahahahaaaa!! Sure skippy. Please name all those dictators that overran all those hunter gatherer bands. There must be a long list.

Hitler would have nuked primitive anarchy back into the Stone-Age.

Franco and Pinochet were expressions of civilization, dumbo.

Spanish civ, remember that! And they both spoke Spanish, an important fact I'll elaborate on later. But first, the backlash from '37 '38 made both these dictators biased more than the average fascist dictator concerning anarchists within the community, and the only way for anarchists to escape the firing squad was to do menial labouring work and road repair to prove their loyalty to the state. How things change!

I found that last part especially funny.

And yeah, I know how those barbaric Spanish Catholics have burned a huge forest just to defeat the Moors. They were butchering their own children and throwing donkeys from high cliffs but hey that must be another story.

I sooo respect the Iberic and Basque anarchists... I mean those that are not fucking social anarchist State suckers, or other liberals. Like those twin girls I met at the ZAD, and their tough yet honest stares. They were at war. So wild and free.

Actually things went downhill after the Moors left, look at my name, the northern anarchists are the barbarians, and for some reason you think I'm an ally to your binary 20th century politics?

Nah your just another pretentious moron who seems to believe in nationalist or racist mythologies about a barbaric culture that glorified repression and make-beliefs for centuries, that's all. No need for self-aggrandizing, my dear....

Anti CIV @s would respond to Franco with bow and arrows. Workists would respond with improvised weapons of war. Iraq Iraq Iraq Iraq.

Add new comment

Filtered HTML

  • Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.
  • Allowed HTML tags: <a> <em> <strong> <cite> <blockquote> <code> <ul> <ol> <li> <dl> <dt> <dd>
  • Lines and paragraphs break automatically.

Plain text

  • No HTML tags allowed.
  • Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.
  • Lines and paragraphs break automatically.
To prevent automated spam submissions leave this field empty.
Enter the code without spaces.