Chris Dorner against the LAPD: 'He knows what he's doing. We trained him'

From Guardian UK

For the hundreds of police officers now searching for him, Dorner's once-prized attributes have taken a sinister turn

In pictures he is invariably in uniform and smiling, and friends say Christopher Jordan Dorner was as direct and warm as his gaze. A big man, a dedicated officer, smart, and good with his hands.

On Friday, as hundreds of heavily armed police swarmed across the snowy mountains of Big Bear, and thousands more fanned across southern California in a tense, frantic manhunt, Dorner's attributes turned sinister, and the smile mocking.

"He knows what he's doing – we trained him," Charlie Beck, chief of the Los Angeles police department, told a press conference. It was a lament. A police force which has provided more than its fair share of dramas over the decades was once again transfixing the United States.

Dorner, 33, who was fired from the LAPD in 2008, is accused of killing three people and wounding two others in self-declared "unconventional and asymmetrical warfare" against his former comrades, a week-long rampage which terrorised police from San Diego to LA and by Friday had shifted to the icy wilderness of Big Bear, a ski resort east of LA, where Dorner was believed to be hiding.

An 11,000 word rambling manifesto he posted on Facebook tried to explain his actions – and listed a 40-person hit list.

Schools, stores and hotels were in lockdown and officers in helmets and body armour trekked warily through the snow lest the fugitive, a former navy reservist and trained marksman, a cop killer and a killer cop, had left traps. "There's always that concern and we're extremely careful and we're worried about this individual," San Bernardino County sheriff John McMahon told reporters. "We're taking every precaution we can."

The weather turned and a storm closed in, wrapping a story which already felt elemental: Dorner was pursuing a vendetta against authority, believing himself a victim of injustice, and the biggest posse in living memory was after him.

Revenge, blood, pursuit, ingredients of countless westerns and action films from Hollywood, on the other side of the mountains, and a story trending on Twitter buzzed with film references: Cape Fear, Rambo, The Deer Hunter, The Bourne Ultimatum, The Fugitive.

In reality Dorner was probably suffering from mental illness and three families were mourning the death of innocents but already, in some minds, he was becoming legend. Facebook pages sprouted in support, hailing him a rebel, and media commentators hyped his martial skills as if the navy reserves really did breed Rambos.

With TV helicopters hovering above Big Bear, buffeted by strengthening winds, Dorner's story was swept into debates about race, gun control and law enforcement.

Christopher Jordan Dorner has declared 'war' against former LAPD colleagues and their families in a manifesto posted online. Photograph: Reuters
According to his manifesto, this week's rampage can in some ways be traced back to racial taunts when he was a black boy in a mostly white school in Norwalk. He struck back with his fists.

Addressing "America" and written in the language of a police report, Dorner casts himself as hero and victim, with his first blows for the fellow first-grader who taunted him.

"My response was swift and non-lethal. I struck him fast and hard with a punch an [sic] kick … that day I made a life decision that I will not tolerate racial derogatory terms spoken to me."

He attended Southern Utah University from 1997 to 2000, graduating with a bachelor's degree in political science and a minor in psychology. He played running back for the football team.

He joined the navy in 2002, serving in Nevada and San Diego and Bahrain, where he was awarded the Iraqi Campaign Medal and National Defense Service Medal, the Global War on Terrorism Service Medal and other medals for marksmanship.

Clint Grimes, a former navy comrade, told reporters that Dorner was excited to join the LAPD, calling it a dream job. He appeared to like military protocol. "I would say, 'Call me Clint,' and he would say, 'Yes sir.'"

Dorner was friendly, bright and technologically savvy, said Grimes. "I never knew him not to be smiling. They're not looking for a stupid guy, here," Grimes said.

The dream job swiftly soured however. He accused a female training partner of kicking a mentally ill homeless man during a routine stop. She denied it, witnesses appeared to back her, and Dorner was fired in 2008 for making false accusations. A tribunal upheld the decision in 2009.

Divorced and without a job, Dorner seethed and called the sacking an affront to his "honor, courage, and commitment". On 31 January he posted his manifesto and on 3 February allegedly killed his first victims: Monica Quan, 28, a basketball coach and her fiancee Keith Lawrence, 27, as they sat in a car in Irvine, south of LA. Quan was the daughter of a police captain who had represented Dorner – negligently, in his view – at the tribunal.

Police woke up to the threat and studied the manifesto in dread: "The violence of action will be high … I will bring unconventional and asymmetrical warfare to those in LAPD uniform whether on or off duty … you will now live the life of the prey."

There are reports Dorner tried to hijack a boat to Mexico after the first alleged attack but was foiled by engine trouble.

As units scrambled to protect those named on the hit list, he was spotted near Corona at 1.30am local time on Thursday and exchange shots with a patrol, grazing one officer in the head. About 20 minutes later he allegedly ambushed two officers at a red traffic light in nearby Riverside, killing one, a veteran, and wounding the other, a trainee.

With dawn yet to break police lashed out but picked the wrong targets. Officers from the Hollywood division blazed at a pick-up truck in Torrance, thinking it was Dorner's grey Nissan, firing more than a dozen bullets, only to find they had hit two women who were delivering newspapers. They were taken to hospital with minor injuries. A few minutes later officers in another part of Torrance opened fire on another pick-up driven mistaken for Dorner's. No one was injured.

On Thursday Dorner's pick-up was found burning at Big Bear. An overnight search of woods and cabins yielded little but footprints. Reinforcements arrived on Friday. They braced for a storm expected to hamper visibility.

At an outdoor news conference San Bernardino county sheriff John McMahon said the hunt in Big Bear would continue until there was clear evidence Dorner had left the area. Fresh snowfall would help with tracking, he said. Officers were searching hundreds of empty cabins one at a time.

Reported sightings in downtown Los Angeles and Barstow kept police on high alert across the state.




And now this:

"Let's figure out how to *end* this thing" wink wink

that charlie sheen video is hilarious

seriously, he is clearly hungover and thanking him for the "kind words" I dont think this could get better

i would never wear this, but it sure made me laugh.

Why was this article posted? I don't see the word "anarchist" anywhere in it.

I posted it because it was interesting

Read the manifesto
Dude is a liberal

so are a lot of anarchists. and they don't declare war on the police.


200 POINTS!!!!!!!

I think it maybe remains to be seen whether his solo war on the police was a completely smart decision. but yes you are right

Depends on how you define "smart." Is he going to get away? Hell no. Even he says that in his manifesto. Eventually, the police will catch up with him, and I give it a 70% probability they kill him immediately. Regardless of what happens now though, he's pretty much secured a position as a folk hero. Maybe if he had just killed a couple cops, it would have blown over, but this business with LAPD shooting random people because they might be him? People love the idea of police being terrified of someone, even if they won't admit it. They spend all their lives terrified of police, even if they won't admit it. Then, someone comes around who gives the cops a taste of their own medicine? Yeah, this won't be soon forgotten.

I do love the idea of the cops being scared, yes

well put

Erm, anarchists are against the police, but they're also against mindless killing, do I actually have to point that out?

no you don't because its not really relevant.

What I find most interesting about this phenomenon is that people hate cops so much, and are so desperate for some sign of resistance, they'll even rush to praise a cop who kills other cops. Dorner's first victims were the daughter of his lawyer and her fiance. He threatens cops' children and says he knows when they have recess at school. His manifesto is filled with militaristic, macho, jingoistic language. Yet "radicals" are circulating a version of his manifesto online that leaves out the crazier, more rambling parts (where he says hi to Charlie Sheen, says people should study his brain scans, lists the movies he wishes he could see etc. You put that stuff in your suicide note and yes, you are insane). Presumably to make him look cooler and more anti-police, a real "folk hero". Yet what leaps from the pages of his "manifesto" is the idea that he was been personally wronged and had his name ruined. He throws in some complaints about racism and corruption, and seems to have a basic sense of fairness. But he was kind of a rat, wasn't he? Why did he file that report on his fellow officer? Mainly he has a personal grudge and wants revenge. He falls back on the only thing he knows: brute force. For an anarchist, I should think the whole affair is disgusting.

If anarchists were stupid and crazy enough to think they could abolish the police by shooting a few at random and killing their children, I think they would have done it.

Damn right! The cult of cop-killing among some anarchists has accepted and diminished the deaths of a young woman and her fiance, who had no involvement in that citadel of cruelty, the LAPD, at the hands of this loose cannon while bringing attention to the cops' own sociopathy. His responsibility in those killings may never be proven, but evidently the possibility of them being a terrible cost is accepted.

This man isn't on our side. Being a cop became a terminal illness for him apparently. There's nothing to be lauded in him spreading the lethal affliction out of vengeance. All of this would come quite naturally to an ex-cop bent on killing as many of his former comrades as possible. If our anarchism is earnest then this isn't someone to be championed. He's the worst sort of cop; the Party member who believes so much in it that he exceeds the dogmas of the Party itself and becomes a threat to the Party's good standing. He reminds me of no one so much as Gavriil Myasnikov, who was more Leninist than Lenin—an embarrassment but one who eventually pleaded with Stalin to go home back to Russia after the world war, but only to his certain death.

Dorner is more LAPD than the LAPD.

You know, I still like vengeance.

I also still like vengeance. I wish anarchists actually committed acts of vengeance instead of cheerleading it all the time.

lol do you think that you can have a revolution without killing cops?

do you think their families will stand for that?

get real. entire bloodlines have to go.

Are you trolling? Anyway the point is that a revolutionary upheaval is different from one guy taking out his frustrations by murdering the daughter of the guy who "wronged" him. Dorner isn't attacking the system, as some pretend. His letter is full of love for cops, marines, Obama, Clinton, Hillary Clinton, Bush Senior etc.

yea. it is different. one of those things is happening and one of them is some stupid pipe dream that never comes.

i don't mean to say that revolution never comes. i mean to say that this idealized notion of "revolutionary upheaval" as opposed to "violent bloody civil war" is a pipe dream.

there will never be the perfect revolutionary messiah. people are fucked up and twisted and insane from thousands of years of a sick sick world. if the revolution ever came, for every good person with a rebel's heart there would be ten dorners at the end of their ropes.

"if the revolution ever came, for every good person with a rebel's heart there would be ten dorners at the end of their ropes."

Let's hope it never comes then.

You are not a good people by any stretch of the imagination.

Come on that's ridiculous, people are fighting for freedom in the Arab world right now and I'm sure they're not 90% psychopaths. Not to mention all the revolutions from 1848 to 1917 to 1936 to 1968. The radical movements from below in Latin America. None of these are perfect events led by perfect people, but we can definitely set the bar higher than cheering for sociopaths on anti-social rampages.

They have made the bar as low as it can go.

On *many* different fronts. It's sickening.

Are you a Maoist-Third Worldist?

yea, i'm on my laptop commenting on @news stories from the mountains of nepal.

oh wait, you meant one of those first world "maoist-third worldists" who say crazy stupid shit on the internet?


no, you're one of those @news commenters who say crazy stupid shit on the internet.

bah, too obvious. hardly even worth calling wit.

why not cite some examples of proletarian revolutions that weren't bloody civil wars and prove me wrong?

Yeah because it's revolutionary to say entire bloodlines have to go... And we all know that there is going to be a revolution in x amount of years and exactly how its going to play out....

You'd probably like the Denver RAIM website!

you're right because it's a lot more feasible to think you can take away people's wealth and power without killing them, and you can kill someone without their family trying to take revenge.

sarcasm game is fun

ITT: the anarcho-Khmer Rouge.

i'm not advocating for the kind of infrastructure required for reeducation camps and gulags. just pointing out that bloody civil war that will certainly include some heavy doses of violence. especially if it's anarchist in nature and has no leadership to direct and control the people's revenge.

there's nothing anarchist about being a mentally ill stalker.

reread the post when i said anarchist in nature i was so far off discussing dorner

i don't know how much further downhill anarchism is going to go in this country but i'd rather see anarchist trying to run gulags and reeducation camps than anarchists "removing bloodlines" from the population. at least the former would show that we had one remaining shred of understanding of how power replicates itself or can be attacked.

There is always blood in war. Civil wars especially tend to be drenched in it. Executions of snitches, traitors and torturers from the opposing side are par for the course. Deaths of good warriors in combat stoke the fires of hate, revenge burns in both sides. Ashes for ashes, blood for blood. The wheel is round and what comes around goes around. Hell, the French were beheading Nazi collaborators all the way to 1969, after the hell they faced from 1940-1944.

Just imagine being a yuppie condo building developer scum, caught on the wrong side of the front line when Civil War II kicks off. A French Revolution style guillotine would not be out of the question, a lamp post the most likely fate. Nobody could stop it. Remember what happens to snitches and expecially brutal prison guards in a prison riot-and what happens afterwards if their co-conspirators ever find or think they've found those who started the riot.

Other than that, this has little to do with the presence or absence of government. It's what people do in war. Shit-there is a theory that what drove the spread of humanity from Africa to the whole world was the extreme lethality of then- new weapons such as the flint-tipped spear and the ability of a mobilized village to exterminate an opponent in a single raid. With such advantage to the offense, people spread as far away from rivals as they could, as fast as possible. That is who we are.

You may ask: Why am I an anarchist when the street and military history have taught me this? Because I believe only a balance of power can ever stop exploitation. The ability of a warlord to crown himself King
does not obligate the local farmers to give him shit. I'd rather be a dead piece of meat feeding crows on a battlefield than a slave any day.

Hell. we've ALWAYS has anarchy between nation-states, and few seriously propose a one-world government with a military strong enough to forcibly occupy objecting states. This is for reasons of trust. Since nation states are usually run by the worst criminals and warlords within them, if anarchy can work in international relations, it can work ANYWHERE!

Without leadership, organization, and discipline, you would only fail.

This is one of the times when you write it's and not its.

Dorner is a pro-gun control liberal, who actually shot several people. Of course I don't like the people he shot, but to hail him as somekind of anarchist superstar is retarded like any Obama/Bush supporter.

If you people are just dumb like the rest of mainstream media sheep to not see the absurdity of the paradox, you ain't worth any anarchy!

Your guns are your rights, no matter if it's Constitutional or self-determined rights. Stick to them.

He is probably suffering from mental illness?

Try Drapetomania: a supposed mental illness described by American physician Samuel A. Cartwright in 1851 that caused black slaves to flee captivity.

You are ridiculous.

I am not ridiculous. I am mentally ill.

I am not ridiculous. I am mentally ill.

I am not ridiculous. I am mentally ill.

this is soooo 2009

He "supports the government 100%" and is intentionally targeting officers of color and lesbians for what amounts to reverse discrimination, so he definitely sucks as an individual, and I think it would be confused and problematic to actively support HIM.... the actions themselves are of course a different matter.

How can we capitalize on the support that he has absolutely garnered?

we can make shirts with his face on it, sell them, and use the money to fund our vegan potlucks.

I don't play with guns but we call them toys
Totin' big straps that make a lot of noise
Talking big money, niggas better know it
Gun never on safety, I'm paranoid
I don't pull it out unless I'm 'bout to shoot
I got military guns, I got goons too
Tryna' find me, where your black suit
You think you gon' catch me slippin', you a damn fool
My bitches strapped, they keep it in they purse
Tryna' ride up on me now you ridin' a hearse
That trippy shit, I'm on another planet (mars)
Niggas hating on me I'm bullet proof, a phantom
Ridin' in a black car, ridin' with a black bag
Black gloves, black hoodie, ridin' with a black mask
I know niggas scared, so don't try to flex
A couple of bullets hit his body tore up his chest

A hundred rounds, I won't miss ya ass
Put your ass on a shirt saying they miss your ass
Your family miss you, your girl miss you
The niggas miss you, Juicy J I won't miss ya
I won't miss ya... Juicy J I won't miss ya

What amuses me about this isn't that I have any sympathy for the guy, I just love these stories where one of the stormtroopers turns rogue and bites the hand. Same as when PTSD veterans go apeshit and shoot up the town before dying in a hail of gunfire. They usually take a few pigs with'em. It's win-win.

Mmmmmmmm... a whole town in exchange for a few pigs is not a win-win. It's a barely mitigated tragedy.

Captain-literal ... it's never the whole town. It's usually the immediate family, some neighbors, then the first responding officers and then maybe one or two SWAT team members on a good day. Sorry your stupid moralism applies so well to something totally beyond our control.

If he came to your door
Would you take him in,
Would you forgive him
Or would you turn him in
For the million $ reward ?

"would you give him a big sloppy kiss? or would you blow his brains out?"

- brian dennehy in first blood

there's been a few instances of the cops rushing to catch this guy and hurting innocent people. there's also been very little talk of "evidence" surrounding any of the killings that Dorner is being blamed.

considering the history of corruption and violence in the l.a.p.d., I'd bet money that something ELSE is going on and the cops are fearful that he knows something that can hurt them. I'd bet more money that they will kill him before he gets to a reporter.

let's ignore cops from now on. why give them any of our psychic energy? why ask them permission to do anything? fuck them.

If he was real about his injustice at the hands of the LAPD he should of taken out the head of command (Chief) as an example... Not the innocent children of someone that tried to help him!
He's clearly insane and must be terminated with extreme prejudice.


he targeted their families for a very real reason that he cited in his manifesto.

he also makes it clear that he believes that there was a conspiracy against him to get him fired from the LAPD and that the person handling his appeal was in on it.

this man lost his mind, but to classify him as "insane" ignores the very real circumstances that led to this. but that's your plan anyway, cop.

Anyhow know anything about this shit i heard - that his original manifesto was changed by teh establishment to include loads of pro-Democrat shit to alienate rightwinger types (or anyone else...) from joining him in anti-cop guerilla war?

Wait, you read a rumor on the interwebz? Really?

If one wants to kill cops, what should be said in a manifesto released either before or during one's cop-killing spree in order to gain the largest amount of popular support?

I don't really want to kill cops, but I would like to highlight the lack of faith in their authority that is rampant even if often unrecognized in our collective psychology. Killing cops seems like a better way of doing this than just pointing it out to people I know, so one might be willing to do it.

Should one go the mental illness route like Dorner? Or coul one still win sympathy and support from a large enough segment of the population even as a more or less sane individual?

Will it be possible to win at least nominal support from the most disillusioned of both the left and the right simultaneously? Should one use overt political rhetoric in order to achieve this or not? Is there a revolutionary language that appeals to both?

If one does use political or revolutionary language, would one also still be able to appeal to broad swaths of the youth, poor, and minorites who do not care about politics per se?

How can a cop-killing spree break through the attention deficit disorder of our times to be remembered beyond the one or two weeks one might be able to evade police and stay in the headlines before being gunned down or etc?

For instance, should one wait a while to avoid being labeled a copycat cop-killer or might that actually be a wise move? Should one start tonight in fact?

For that matter, should one kill many cops in just one rampage or be more methodical and try to drag it out over days or possibly even weeks to months somehow?

Is it possible to get away completely after initiating something like this? Would leaving the state be enough or would one have to leave the country? Does the personal advantage in getting away even outweigh the dramatic advantage of tense and filmed standoff with police?

If you'll pardon the pun, where were the fans while he was burning up???

Police created the problem. They murder, torture and abuse their (illegitimate) authority nationwide on a daily bases. Now they want tanks and drones as well. Go police! Those poor guys?

The moral to the story is there isn't one.

Cop goes nuts kills people... that's never happen before. In uniform = ok, out of uniform = not ok.

However this tragic affair has fueled my cop on cop killing/porn late night masturbation sessions for weeks to cum.

The LA pigs were, as usual, unable to defeat an armed opponent in a prepared, fortified postiion, so they burned him alive. Here are some quotes from the police scanner:

"Burners deployed and we have a fire"


Scanner audio: in .ogg format:

Never forget: This is the KKKountry that burned half of Japan with firebombs in WWII before finishing with nukes. They used to burn Native American villages and shoot anyone who escapes. They have been playing with fire for 500 years, but they scream if someone throws a molotov cocktail into an empty pig car!

THey do that because they know they are in danger if people get out of line. Even with all this high-tech militaristic apparatus of control, they still are outnumbered and surrounded... and many people in the US have guns already.

Big steroid cops and drones won't help when people start to protest with their Desert Eagles and Ak-74's at their shoulders.

We need more than heavy caliber handguns and .556 auto rifles to carry the day against capitalism's artillery. No matter how many guerillas you have, access to small arms is barely the beginning. In fact, how many guerillas is more important than how many rifles, if they are motivated and ready to learn.

We need good physical condition and training, including the ability to keep one's head in combat and think under fire. Can you hump a heavy pack containing a day's food and all your mission gear over hills for a few miles? What about when you have to leave out the food to carry an unexpected item like the radio jammer or extra ammo? How do you reach when you are being chased by the pigs? Do you panic, or do you keep your head, think "shut up" when they try to blast you with sirens, and think about overall strategy while your automatic mind takes care of immediate necessities? How do you react under fire, assuming you've been shot at at least once?

In war like in judo every move and every weapon has its counter. In Vietnam the key was to get close to the Enemy so the Amerikkkans couldn't use their artillery. In Afghanistan insurgents join the security forces, then suddenly launch attacks. In Iraq the Resistance answered house raids backed by US heavy artillery and air power with massive, daisy-chained IEDs on the supply routes. Choke those off, and the big guns fall silent. If their big guns are all on drones, electronic warfare becomes the key to killing them-and there WE have the advantage! Drones are also so cheap all states and most insurgencies can afford them, I think drone warfare will be the biggest mistake the Pentagon ever made.

How much trouble would the LAPD have been in if they had not only faced the one opponent they did, but his entire family including two logistics specialists, one soldier in the field, one dedicated radio/scanner operator, one hacker, and one drone "hobbyist?" How much more trouble would they have had if Mr Dornier had carefully avoided harm to the innocent and thus become a folk hero covertly fed and housed by secret supporters? He burned his own future when he killed family members of his first target.

And how does any of that get done without discipline and organization?

These must come from within. Every true insurgency is like that, as it would be entirely too easy for people to desert if they were subjected to externally-imposed brutality. Also, don't kid yourself: it's not organization anarchists are opposed to, only externally-imposed, nonconsensual organization. We don't draft, that doesn't mean we can't organize.

At the opposite extreme, all the really elite military units (like the SEALS) structure their training programs to weed out anyone who doesn't have the internal, self-motivated discipline required for isolated, small-unit operations. When the SEALS go through one of the most extreme military training programs on the entire planet, that "I quit" bell on the beach is always staring at them.

At our level, street experience and previous bad experiences motivate people to train and prepare. Anyone caught by the pigs (but ever getting out) because they were out of shape and had no way to compensate will do something about that before going back out if they are smart. Hell-the team that did Vail was credited with hauling half a ton of incendiaries up the mountain on their backs. They didn't get caught until Fergerson snitched. They had problems, but they worked around their weaknesses and made the most of their strengths.

Jeezus if ever you're incarcerated take the time to learn how to put a decent sentence together!

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